Pub 115 Feedback Thread

Grimbeard

Petra_Fyde said:

Grimbeard said:I wanted to tell Allen to quit asking for the easy button but agree the terrain there is terrible worse than the area around champ spawn on fel side

I wondered how far apart the two altars were, so I went to have a look in Fel.
here's the map, the larger skull is the test center location


If that proves to be the actual intended location I'll be using an archer, so I can clear the ledges while other chars clear the open areas.

To me for a limited time pvm spawm the area to the east makes more sense 

Skett

is that the lost lands

Mariah

Yes, hoppers bog to be precise.

Pawain

If it is going to be a swamp. 

Put the spawn in the swamp between Minoc and Brit. It is nice and flat. No houses.

Yoshi

"how you can complain about the location of the new champ spawn?
its in same location as a champ spawn in fel, nobody has ever complained about hoppers bog location"

Arroth_Thaiel

Psst...

None of the dynamic champ spawns has ever been deployed to Live with the same location as was on Test Center. At least not that I'm aware of...

If you re-read Kyronix post, he does not ask about feedback concerning the location.

Kyronix

We're planning to deploy the champ spawn in the current location.  If you have feedback on that, we're happy to listen.  There is a preset list of areas we can deploy these types of champ spawns so we're limited somewhat.

Arroth_Thaiel

Well, hardly the first time I've been completely wrong...

Cinderella

I would rather the champ spawn be in the swamp south of destard.
Britain swamp is too close to housing and I could see someone luring stuff to peoples houses 
or it spawning inside housing.

I would prefer the swamp south of destard.
much easier terrain to deal with.

Hoppers Bog my pet went to attack something and I couldn't figure out how to get to it.
I actually had to use the moongate to go to Britain to get it back. (I tried to teleport to where it was, but couldn't see the location the cu was standing)

Larisa

As I said, tamers might not be the best choice for this one. My Cu tends to run off all over the place no matter what commands I give him! Minds of their own!

The terrain is really bad for pets and line of sight, but when I spawn I usually use my sampire, attack multiple targets instead of one at a time works better. Archers work well too as long as you have the Select nearest hostile/attack selected macro it runs a bit smoother.

Tamers will have a hard time with this area but it's not impossible.

The swamp south of Destard where the savages are? Not big enough and buildings in the way, not a good spot.

Hopper's has always been a not so nice place to spawn, back in the day when I used to spawn every day, we avoided Hopper's whenever possible! lol.

Petra_Fyde

Cinderella said:

Hoppers Bog my pet went to attack something and I couldn't figure out how to get to it.
I actually had to use the moongate to go to Britain to get it back. (I tried to teleport to where it was, but couldn't see the location the cu was standing)

Here's how I deal with that - and I've done it in pictures in case I don't explain well.


1. mark a rune below where the pet is stuck
2. walk a short way away from it
3. Cast a gate on the rune
4. walk through the gate - pet will appear at the gate.

Jepeth

Here's my feedback for what we've seen so far. I expressed some of this to Kyronix on the first day when he was kind enough to stand in the Britain Commons for a bit.

I still believe this to be a more exclusionary mechanic versus the egg pick-up. During the previous system I enjoyed wandering around finding them, getting into little races with folks as we rushed to the eggs, and generally seeing people out exploring the world. I'm sorry that because of scripters they've gone a different direction for this publish. But, I get it.

Now, having a mechanic which utilizes an under-used part of the game (gardening and green thorns) is not a bad idea at all! In fact, I'm kind of into seeing the creativity on display there. But my critique here is that green thorns are not a resource many folks have stock-piled. Kyronix, in our talk, said something like "I don't think everything should always be available all the time." (I do apologize if my paraphrasing isn't right here.) I hear that, but I want people to enjoy the new content. To get into the game and get going on the cool new stuff without getting time-gated behind growing the plants, or simply pay a ton of gold from resource speculators. So to me it's like this system is missing one more element. Like there's a potion of instant plant growing that players could loot off of some mobs, or a side quest that rewarded ten thorns a day. Some other kind of mechanic that augments this and provides another avenue to unlocking the content. I'm no slouch when it comes to hoarding wealth and resources on my shard, but even I couldn't get more than 8 green seeds before everything was gone from Vendor Search.

When it came to actually using the thorns, these were my ten draws:



I know Kyronix said to ignore this information but based on what we've been working out over on Discord, it's clear part of this is a luck check. The player's luck must beat a randomly determined number, and if so you get an egg in your pack. The best I can do on my luck suit on my home shard is 2910, which means if I had placed these ten thorns there I would have gotten 5 eggs.

Putting aside whether or not having that much luck (in one of these cases it wanted me to have 3652 luck!) to earn an egg is a good thing, I think it should be said that we're getting a concrete system where luck matters in a meaningful way. I know we won't see this debug information on our home shards, but for all the uncertainty and local folk lore around how luck works in the game, it's interesting to see the team give us such a clear-cut mechanic. Anything that combats misinformation in the game is good!

Concerning the champ spawn, I think the four levels of creatures were fine. Definitely ramped up in difficulty as things went. I do not think the boss needs the regenerative health ala EM bosses. Seven or eight of us were wailing on that thing for over 20 minutes before the first regeneration. As has been said, it's a bit much for most non-Atlantic shards. I got 4 eggs in the very first wave, which seemed to match what others were getting. No one seemed to have gotten an egg in the last two rounds.

Concerning the fishing pole, as expressed to Kyronix already I'm personally fine with it as is, or if changed with just spell channeling. I don't think a best-in-slot item should ever be locked into the vet reward system. There's no reason for it to have slayer or stats of any kind. My fishers would like a fun hue on it, though. 



I think this was very sweet, and appreciate him sharing that with us. Especially as I can now stop trying to figure that name origin out!

I think the vet reward flags look amazing, and can't wait to have a few of those out. I see this, the flag of the Great Nation-State of Booze, being the most popular:



The salvage station and refinement workbench don't appeal to me, but I think I agree with others when they say the station's use is limited. But, Kyronix did say to us that those really are intended to be more deco than integral items. I respect that viewpoint for veteran rewards, personally. I'd much rather we get functional items through game play and the fancy deco/peacocking stuff through the vet system.

The Mondain's Revenge Valentine's Day dolls are cute enough. I like their heart animation. Sometimes it feels like we've got far too many dolls in this game, though? Like someone is really into toys in the art department. I'd much rather the team sell dolls like that in real life and in-game we get items that don't break the fourth-wall. 

If the list of potential rewards has not yet been finalized, some previous I'd still like to see return are the Mark of Wildfire, Yukio's Earrings, Drogeni's Spellbook, the Wand of Warding, and the Lantern of Protection. The first two, obviously, will help with the luck that part of the event will require. Drogeni's is just dead-useful for a lot of character types, and the two shield transmog targets are always popular. 

Arroth_Thaiel

I was just running through the spawn again and here are some thoughts...

The actual spawn creatures are pretty weak. Only the Dread Spiders (Spider slayer?) and Skrees (Dragon Slayer?) are casters, so there is not much danger for most of the spawn.

Any template that is follower dependent is going to have a rough time due to the terrain and LoS issues.

Any template that has non-targeted AoE damage can just roll through the spawn. I worked the spawn to Dread Spiders, solo, with little effort, using Earthquake/Wither spam on a character that is supposed to be a Spellweaver. With the rate I was going, I could probably have popped the champ solo, on an out of spec mage. 

Templates with EQ, Wither, Thunderstorm, Essence of Wind (especially EoW; it seems to do better than the others) are going to do very well during the spawn itself.

Yes, the power level on those AoE spells disappears completely once the champ spawns. However due to the champ's abilities, if you have a tank in front of you, you can just switch to Wraith Form/Death Ray and keep on chugging. 

As it is now, I'm suspecting a team of two, one AoE caster for the spawn, and one fighter to tank the champ, should be able to finish off this encounter fairly quickly.


P.S. Necromantic summons are about, no they are, worthless. However, you can probably solo the entire spawn with just Wither, so Necro Caster, rather than Necro Pet Handler, for the win.

I guess that's thematically consistent. Spring Event. Spring = Life and Rebirth. Necro is kinda anti-life (yet quite pro rebirth eh?) 

keven2002

I've had time to test the new stuff on TC1 but due to forums issues haven't been able to post my findings/opinions so apologies in advance for a lengthy post.

@Kyronix

Dynamic spawn:

• Location should change to a place where there aren't so many "stuck" spots. It will make higher level things that spawn up there very hard to kill unless an archer is helping work the spawn.
• Boss should NOT have multiple HP regens. Doing this will drastically hurt shards that are not well populated like ATL (especially given the final drop isn't best in slot or OP).
• Boots aren't bad. One ask I'd have is to switch them to be 2HP/2Stam/2Mana so that if our suits have us at the 150 stat cap we could still use them. If the boss is going to keep the 75/50/25 regen these boots need to be much better though.
• I think the skree might be a little tough given their extremely fast casting. Getting 2-3 of these on you without a mount is death.

Dynamic event:

• I think the mini abominations are a cool switch up from from last year and are probably where they should be as far as difficulty given drops aren't guaranteed. This shouldn't be as easy to bot as the eggs were last year.
• One question here is whether or not the Fel luck bonus of +1000 luck goes towards the luck roll (I would think it should??). I do not think it does currently as I was in Fel doing some rabbits and one of my luck to beat rolls was 3609 and my luck "failed" at 2700 (would be 3700 with Fel bonus). 

Vet Rewards:

• The pixie and moloch statues are cool looking but the sand vortex in classic client looks like a tan blob. I think a tan energy vortex statue would look much better (it's what they actually look like in CC).
• Guild flags are a nice touch. No change there besides maybe additional flag pics (ie Jolly Roger) down the road.
• Frost mite ethy has potential but I don't think the transparent hue is the best option for it because depending on the way you are facing (left vs right) the shape either looks good (facing left) or weird (facing right) due to the shadow and ethy color. Same when you face SE; there is a weird shading with the lower half being almost black and the upper half being transparent. Wondering if the default color (of the statue) would be an option? Might look better. Also... I haven't been able to reproduce it but I did end up losing a frost mite when dismounting. The statue never went back into my pack even after relogging. 
• Fishing pole, as many said needs some additional properties. Personally I think SC (no -1) would be a must. The pole could use some luck but shouldn't be anywhere near best in slot luck at 400+. I think 200-250 luck is about right. The only other thing I think it should have is maybe like +10% bait strength. The last tweak I think would be a nice touch since it's a vet reward is to make it a different color / different graphic than a regular fishing pole.
• Refinement station hasn't created any refinements since being placed so I guess it will be 1 refinement per week? Seems like a bit of a waste given that there are literally 10+ armor types alone for humans across 5 different level (defense/protect/etc) and 2 different options (+resist or +DCI). Is there anyway to change this to something like soulstone holder where it will be a large gump container to hold refinements without taking up lockdowns? The problem most people have isn't getting the refinements, it's holding onto them while they get more of the ones they need to combine.
• Salvage station, as most have said is really just a very expensive salvage bag since it will only salvage cloth and ingots AND it's more inconvenient because instead of crafting in a salvage bag in your pack and salvaging from there, people need to manually add all items to the machine. It's way more cost effective and convenient to go spend 1300gp at the provisioner unless the salvage station will be able to salvage everything from amor like bone/wood/granite/gems/etc 

Pawain

@Kyronix ; I love the flow of the theme. The creatures are coming from a SWAMP. The early mobs have SEEDS you can feed the boglings to the fat mouths. Swamp creatures have interesting feeding habits. I love introducing the Skrees maybe players will see that they make excellent spell casting pets. They are green, they go with the swamp. The Boss is perfect for a swamp. You plant the seeds to grow plants with THORNS to use to summon an ABOMINATION bunny. 

This would make an interesting quest for a season of NL!

Just saying pets are not smart enough to navigate the terrain very well.  LS is a Tamer shard they will use their pets.  Would be easier for them if it were a flatter swampland.  Or Swampify Yew again.

Can we have a list of the Dungeons that could possibly be used for the dungeon events? PLEASE
  

Riner

                I'm seeing trends of higher luck needed to get eggs as I work the bunnies on test and needing a max or near max luck suit to get eggs either in Tram or Fel. I do seem to get almost 100% eggs in Fel due to the increased luck and run around 40-50% in Tram. This may be a way to encourage people to do this in Fel instead of Tram, which a number of people have been begging for in the past. This can be worked around with a luck statue for a limited period if the account is old enough. I do think that the threshold for getting an egg is too high, as not everyone or even most people have a max luck suit. With low luck the odds of getting eggs in Tram is near zero, which will have the greatest effect on newer or less equipped players. I'd ask that some consideration be given to their ability to get eggs in Tram. 
           Now I find it interesting that for me the best toons to collect eggs are my tamers as they have the most luck. While the best toons to do the champ spawns seem to be my sampire and archers. I am going to try out the above noted caster approach. Might be a way to work past having a large shard population. I could then see my tamers being more useful at the spawn as well, as I could cast earthquake, Essence of Wind, and temporally put on Necro, for whither, then cast whither, death ray, and send in pet for the champ.
           As for rewards I would also like to see Mark of Wildfire, Yukio's Earrings, the Wand of Warding, and the Lantern of Protection make a return I would also enjoy seeing Solaria's Secret Poisons make a return but hope for some new things as well such as a gorget with Balron Armor Stats, made out of studded leather, a new talisman with either similar to the new demon and fey slayers with a different slayer on it, I'm sure plenty of people don't have a full cameo set and need the other super slayers. 
        I'm really looking forward to this spring should prove lots of fun. Thanks!

Skett

its really cool how the fishing pole got its name, well done hope it gets a hue on it that is never used again @Kyronix ill be getting for sure

Arroth_Thaiel

Hey @Pawain or @PlayerSkillFTW or someone who knows something about pets,

Are there any viable AoE pet builds? Something that could hit the critters in the hilly terrain around the champ spawn?

If there was, your tamer friends would be happy with you for sharing! The existence of such builds might also drive diversity in pet builds, power scroll consumption, and PvP in the months leading up to and during the spawn.

If there aren't any viable builds, that's too bad, people seem to love playing with their pets. If there are, the above might be good reasons to leave the spawn where it is.

--

keven2002,

I'm in agreement about the fishing pole. After reading other posts I think 400 Luck is too high. I wouldn't want to see every t-hunter running around holding a fishing pole. If max Luck from main/off hand is 380, it would be nice to see something in that realm though, just to even up fishers with t-hunters and knowing that fishers can't ever get the off-hand. Maybe 300 on the pole with the choice to enhance to 340? Or 260 with the chance to enhance to 300? T-hunters would still be better off with main/off hand, but fishers would be able to close the gap significantly. Who knows, Kyronix might not even be considering luck.

I also agree with adding 10 or 20% bait strength or 1-5 fishing skill. Something fishing related. Reduced crab pot loss? The pole is nice already: no shoes, blessed, and can be enhanced. However, since it is a 2 year vet reward, a buff seems ok.

Cinderella

Skett said:

its really cool how the fishing pole got its name, well done hope it gets a hue on it that is never used again @ Kyronix ill be getting for sure

they should make it the dynamic forces or wildfire hue
something that makes you take notice

Grimbeard

No one but a Fisherman is gonna run around with a 400 luck pole with no other mods such an old Grumpy jaded group that hates seeing anyone else get nice things

keven2002

Riner said:

                I'm seeing trends of higher luck needed to get eggs as I work the bunnies on test and needing a max or near max luck suit to get eggs either in Tram or Fel. I do seem to get almost 100% eggs in Fel due to the increased luck and run around 40-50% in Tram. This may be a way to encourage people to do this in Fel instead of Tram, which a number of people have been begging for in the past. This can be worked around with a luck statue for a limited period if the account is old enough. I do think that the threshold for getting an egg is too high, as not everyone or even most people have a max luck suit. With low luck the odds of getting eggs in Tram is near zero, which will have the greatest effect on newer or less equipped players. I'd ask that some consideration be given to their ability to get eggs in Tram. 
          

I did not find the +1000 luck bonus to be working in Fel. I tested this a few times which is a bit tricky because you need the "luck roll" requirement to be more than you have but not by more than 1k. I was able to get this a couple times over the past day or 2 and was able to screenshot it. 

Below you will sort of see of what I mean. It says Player luck must be 772 and my max luck (which is my current luck) is 275. If the Fel bonus was working it should say 1275 was my max luck AND I should have gotten an egg drop in my pack since the required luck was under 1k; I should have automatically gotten it from the Fel bonus alone. I also did not get an egg on the corpse.

Yoshi

"he already said stop trying to interpret the debug info, and that its useless without context"

Skett

i could never figure out those robix cube things either

Grimbeard

Every TOT has included best in slot items for warriors and mages now we get a fishing pole and everyone is crying OP OP i really just don't get it

Arroth_Thaiel

Some additional info on the spawn...

While Bog Things (the champ model) don't have slayers (?), Bog Thing Killer% / Protector% might appear on Talisman. Boglings as well.

Forest Ostard, Giant Serpent, and Dread Spider all have Killer% / Protector% talismans.

I only checked Atl/Pac for talis and it looks like most everything on VS was there for crafting %'s, not killer/protector. I was surprised not to see an Alligator or Scorpion talis. They might exist, but nobody is keeping them.

Anyway, might be a buff (and or protection) for certain critters for fighters if you don't have Cameo's or Slayers.

Pawain

@Arroth_Thaiel ; since a non mount would work since the pet is always running around.

A 100 skill Skree that just has Armor ignore would work fine for a pet. Do not change the magic.
They come with Magery and Mysticism. Pet spells dont do a lot of damage but at least they will hit more things.  It will be running all over the place.

Oreogl

@Kyronix

are green thorns going to be only available via growing?  or is there going to be another way to harvest these?

Grimbeard

Both my archer and thrower had no difficulty with spawn tamers will have to keep pets close and even sampire might have trouble as much of the spawn will be on ledges etc

Kyronix

Oreogl said:

@ Kyronix

are green thorns going to be only available via growing?  or is there going to be another way to harvest these?

Grow them or purchase them from other players.

Grimbeard

With crafting evolving to its current state can we get resources given updated as well? ample supply of all imbuing ingredients (including relic fragments etc gems etc) also maybe a forged anvil so we can enhance properly?