High Seas Update: Treasure Chests & MIB Treasures

Urge

After careful consideration I believe there are better substitutes for the addition of remove trap. As is, the t-hunter has to balance fighting and t-hunting skills. An increase to mobs along with adding another skill would create a disaster to the class and force a single template similar to how the samp became the only fighter template.

I will offer my thoughts of a remove trap rework.

1) the addition of a pirate treasure chest on board ships that could require the remove trap skill. One could use the revamped cannons to slay the pirates and have the needed skills to open the chest. This would perfectly fit into a High Seas theme. 

2) dungeon chests are in desperate need of a rework. Without truly needing fighting skills to open dungeon chests, a true dungeon crawler could indeed fit remove trap and if need be, item id to create a new class of players while making two unused skills worthy.

Bilbo

JollyJade said:

Kyronix said:

Consider this,

Cartography is not required beyond initial decoding. 
Mining is not required due to advances in UI/Davie's Locker.
Remove Trap is not required because of Telekenesis.  
Lockpicking (in some instances) isn't required.

What we are left with then?  Where's the actual "Treasure Hunter" profession in this scenario?  What distinguishes this particular template from one you can use to fight any other encounter in the game world?

Have players expressed being unhappy with their current templates?

I have seen a lot discussion about loot, but little being unhappy not to carry say Lockpicking.

Go ahead, kill the T-Hunters for some highly cosmetical thoughts about dead skills. If I can't do them anymore without using a second account, I will put T-Hunting next to the Haven mines, Despise or everything Eodon except for Shadowguard.

Maybe I'm just playing this game wrong.

What is your template that you use?  Where are you getting the idea that he wants to add skills to the T-Hunter?  He is trying to condense the skills required like no longer requiring mining.  IMHO I get the idea that he is looking at Cart, Remove Trap and Lockpick as the 3 needed skills.  Stop slamming because Kyronix hasn't set nothing in stone and has been very open to ideas which is something we have not had in a long time.  A lot of the temps being shown could lose mining and put remove trap on with no loss.

LilyGrace

So, I don't think I've trained or used Detect Hidden and / or Remove Trap since Factions were first introduced long ago and I've long since left those skills behind. I don't have them stoned away so I'd be training them up again. I realize we're not needing DH to find the secret compartment content that may be added to chests. But since reading here that there is game content out there that requires DH to find, I thought I'd start training in it to see what it's like now. Additionally, DH and RT haven't been divorced so I can't train RT without DH.

I agree with Petra. The delay between tries on these skills is a bummer. I find myself sitting here with my eyes rolling up into the back of my head while waiting to hit DH again. If RT is the same then, UGH! I don't know for sure but I'm guessing losing the wait on DH might impact PvP? But I can't think of any need for a long wait between tries on RT.

It seems there's still a lot of pushback, even with getting rid of mining, on bringing RT in on treasure hunting. I hadn't considered that many "treasure hunter" builds aren't using mining. So bringing in RT has them dropping a skill their build can't do without. For the most part it looks like we're a bunch of magic users and tamers digging up chests. 

I think it's sad we're now so far away from using skills that have us portraying melee fighting, swashbuckling rogues out on high seas adventures. And if UO still offered healthy well populated shards I'd be fighting to make treasure hunting an activity geared toward character builds of that ilk. But it is what it is and I don't think anyone wants to unravel and make unhappy those who've been using their magic user / tamer builds for treasure hunting for quite some time.

As it stands, I believe the risk vs reward with treasure hunting is already deserving of a revamp that brings better, more interesting, fun prizes for the effort, even if no new hidden compartment type content is added. That said, I do think it would be fun to add new content beyond picking the lock, stepping back and casting telekinesis. I don't know how deep we can reasonably dig here. Pun intended. My inclination is to create a need for rogue skills in order to get to this additional content. 

If one of the goals is to successfully bring in additional game content that will utilize the Remove Trap skill, I'm hoping the effort will extend itself beyond this singular need with treasure chests. If more reasons to invest in this skill are on the horizon it might make changes to treasure hunting more palatable. As time has gone on, reading through what everyone has had to say in threads dedicated to new High Seas content, the idea that we might be able to create a whole new rogue character type has, in my mind, grown with it. I'd be happy to train up a Freddy the Fence...

I've been working on this post for so long, my husband tells me there have been additional posts made that are along the lines of what I'm talking about. I'll leave it here and go play catch up on reading before talking more about a new rogue build.

Faeryl

Honestly, I'm amazed at how many are having a fit over the possibility of remove trap being a requirement and outright denouncing the idea.

Do any of you know how it would be revamped? No? Why not give it a chance on TC if and when it gets there, first?

There are still viable fighting templates that can be made. For the devs to make a skill viable, as so so many people complain about wanting, people have to learn to adapt to said skill becoming a requirement somewhere. "Make it useful but not affect how I have fun" doesn't work. You can't have it both ways. And how would remove trap for treasure hunting not be logical? 

I feel what I'm seeing is a lot of resistance because people want both the maximum reward, and maximum power and ability. But in this case, as it should be to make a certain template viable, a certain skill requirement is necessary. 

Frankly... if you want any "dead" skills revamped as I see people call for a lot, stop demanding that every skill not affect you or your play style. Adapt. Experiment. Stop being so bloody resistant to an idea that has yet to even be tested.

Bilbo

^^^^^^^^^^BOOM^^^^^^^^^^

LilyGrace

Urge said:

...I will offer my thoughts of a remove trap rework.

1) the addition of a pirate treasure chest on board ships that could require the remove trap skill. One could use the revamped cannons to slay the pirates and have the needed skills to open the chest. This would perfectly fit into a High Seas theme. 

2) dungeon chests are in desperate need of a rework. Without truly needing fighting skills to open dungeon chests, a true dungeon crawler could indeed fit remove trap and if need be, item id to create a new class of players while making two unused skills worthy.

I like a lot of what Urge is saying here

 The quickest fix, not ruffling the feathers of treasure hunters who don't have treasure hunter builds, would be to revamp maps. Let players use cartography to decode maps before going on their dig. Have maps, after they've been decoded, offer the coordinates. Drop cartography and pick up Remove Trap. It's not the most interesting solution and it doesn't bring much High Seas flavor, but it would work.

As I've continued to read what others are saying regarding the ushering in of new High Seas content, the idea of buoying the need for rogues and their skills has continued to grow in my mind. 

I'm again going back to the idea of offering loot drops that would be fully realized off the dig site, or after you've captured the dread pirate, or after you've left your dungeon crawl. 

Remember back when items had handles that said things like, "A magic sword", "A magic wand", etc., etc.? And we had to have Item ID to make known exactly what we were looking at? 

I'm not at all saying we should go back to that in order to know what we're looking at with all the magic items we find in our loot. But I believe adding game content, that players would be happy to find, in treasure chests, on pirate ships, in dungeon chests, or on dispatched monsters found in those arenas, requiring Freddy the Fence' rogue skills could be great fun!

Why not, instead of dealing with the rancor of those worried about their builds, go ahead and revamp regular loot, without players having to make any change to their characters? But also let us create a new rogue build that helps the treasure hunter, high seas sailor, or dungeon crawler get to the mysterious loot they've found but can't quite understand without a little help? Who doesn't love the prize in the box of Cracker Jack? I'd be thrilled to make a rogue with Cartography Lockpicking, Detect Hidden, Remove Trap and Item ID that could help discover the prize.

Thanks for reading.

LilyGrace

Faeryl said:

Honestly, I'm amazed at how many are having a fit over the possibility of remove trap being a requirement and outright denouncing the idea.

Do any of you know how it would be revamped? No? Why not give it a chance on TC if and when it gets there, first?

There are still viable fighting templates that can be made. For the devs to make a skill viable, as so so many people complain about wanting, people have to learn to adapt to said skill becoming a requirement somewhere. "Make it useful but not affect how I have fun" doesn't work. You can't have it both ways. And how would remove trap for treasure hunting not be logical? 

I feel what I'm seeing is a lot of resistance because people want both the maximum reward, and maximum power and ability. But in this case, as it should be to make a certain template viable, a certain skill requirement is necessary. 

Frankly... if you want any "dead" skills revamped as I see people call for a lot, stop demanding that every skill not affect you or your play style. Adapt. Experiment. Stop being so bloody resistant to an idea that has yet to even be tested.

Truth

Swroberts

Faeryl said:

Honestly, I'm amazed at how many are having a fit over the possibility of remove trap being a requirement and outright denouncing the idea.

Do any of you know how it would be revamped? No? Why not give it a chance on TC if and when it gets there, first?

There are still viable fighting templates that can be made. For the devs to make a skill viable, as so so many people complain about wanting, people have to learn to adapt to said skill becoming a requirement somewhere. "Make it useful but not affect how I have fun" doesn't work. You can't have it both ways. And how would remove trap for treasure hunting not be logical? 

I feel what I'm seeing is a lot of resistance because people want both the maximum reward, and maximum power and ability. But in this case, as it should be to make a certain template viable, a certain skill requirement is necessary. 

Frankly... if you want any "dead" skills revamped as I see people call for a lot, stop demanding that every skill not affect you or your play style. Adapt. Experiment. Stop being so bloody resistant to an idea that has yet to even be tested.

Treasure Hunting will not make you rich in this game and to just increase the level of grinding is unnecessary for something that is relaxing and cool, takes about 30 minutes from end to end... Maybe you get a blue scroll maybe a decent orb... But your financial place in the game remains the same.
I am not saying that remove trap doesn't have a place here. Just how, needs to be fully vetted out by those who care... If you have never been involved in a coding project, or any project.... the time to kill crap sandwiches is now...on paper. If you wait until testing, money has been spent planning, flow charting and deconfliction, intitial coding,debugging, testing, etc etc... (coding processes differ) ... All before it gets to the test center... So the inputs/complaints here are fully justified... If you wait until the test center it's too late... Yes there can be some adjustments here and there... But very close to the final project is what you are seeing... 

Yadd_of_Legends

(EDIT: I just noticed this post is not after the one I was responding to - somebody asked the time of the weekly Wednesday Catskills Scalis net toss)

7:30 pm EST - BTW, this kind of group activity, where anybody can just drop in and start fighting for a chance at a drop, should be a model for at least some future activities, in my opinion 

Yadd_of_Legends

Re @Kyronix asking for thunter templates:
120 mystic (with L3 mastery for tougher RCs)
120 focus
120 music
120 discord
110 magery
110 meditation
GM carto - then switch for locks after decoding
Note: With EC maps being so exact, I've never needed mining 
This one can easily solo all maps through L7, unless a whole lot of those crazy L7 changelings in Ilshenar spawn
As far as working with a group, as has been said, nowadays the loot isn't there to justify more people being there
Also has has been said, the mechanics of digging up and opening the chest is moot - the fun is finding the chest and beating the spawn - with a small hope of finding something worthwhile for your effort

Maximus_Neximus

I don't want to quote the whole quote tree...

"The quickest fix, not ruffling the feathers of treasure hunters who don't have treasure hunter builds, would be to revamp maps. Let players use cartography to decode maps before going on their dig. Have maps, after they've been decoded, offer the coordinates. Drop cartography and pick up Remove Trap. It's not the most interesting solution and it doesn't bring much High Seas flavor, but it would work."

This assumes that everyone has two soulstones where they can freely swap skills, with one always having cartography or remove trap. While it works for a lot of vets, it probably doesn't work for newer players or those new to treasure hunting.

Swroberts

Drakelord said:

Swroberts said:

@ kryonix 
If you want to see a great high seas group event stop by this evening at the Catskills New Magencia docks for the weekly Wednesday whitenet Toss, 1930est.. quite a few participants... If in consideration for change, increasing the ancient scroll drop rate or increasing the scalis spawn from 25% would really help support this...

what time is this?

730est

LilyGrace

Maximus_Neximus said:

I don't want to quote the whole quote tree...

"The quickest fix, not ruffling the feathers of treasure hunters who don't have treasure hunter builds, would be to revamp maps. Let players use cartography to decode maps before going on their dig. Have maps, after they've been decoded, offer the coordinates. Drop cartography and pick up Remove Trap. It's not the most interesting solution and it doesn't bring much High Seas flavor, but it would work."

This assumes that everyone has two soulstones where they can freely swap skills, with one always having cartography or remove trap. While it works for a lot of vets, it probably doesn't work for newer players or those new to treasure hunting.

Pretty sure it's vets that are taking issue with rebuilding established characters they use for treasure hunting. :-)  I think a new player would create the character / characters needed to get the job done. They wouldn't have to stone anything.

Maximus_Neximus

LilyGrace said:

Maximus_Neximus said:

I don't want to quote the whole quote tree...

"The quickest fix, not ruffling the feathers of treasure hunters who don't have treasure hunter builds, would be to revamp maps. Let players use cartography to decode maps before going on their dig. Have maps, after they've been decoded, offer the coordinates. Drop cartography and pick up Remove Trap. It's not the most interesting solution and it doesn't bring much High Seas flavor, but it would work."

This assumes that everyone has two soulstones where they can freely swap skills, with one always having cartography or remove trap. While it works for a lot of vets, it probably doesn't work for newer players or those new to treasure hunting.

Pretty sure it's vets that are taking issue with rebuilding established characters they use for treasure hunting. :-)  I think a new player would create the character / characters needed to get the job done. They wouldn't have to stone anything.

Maybe, maybe not. In a game that has been around for so long, what is considered new players? One day? One years? Two years? If someone started playing two years ago, it wouldn't be impossible to have 7 characters already done or at least planned out with progress. They weren't around when soul stones were given out at AOS. After one year you get three vet rewards. If it were me, I'd go with commodity box, crystal portal, and corrupted crystal portal. Year two, maybe I take that first soul stone. Again, others could be different but we can't just think about vets who have been around for a decade or more.

Uriah_Heep

LilyGrace said:

:-)  I think a new player would create the character / characters needed to get the job done. They wouldn't have to stone anything.

A creature as mythical as Sasquatch...

LilyGrace

Parnoc

My THunter never touches a soulstone, his skills are there and stay there!!

I have no idea how people that switch skills get it done, must take forever to dig just a few maps.

I have never seen a paragon Renegade Changeling..... really?  Would that even be possible to kill?

Faeryl

Parnoc said:

My THunter never touches a soulstone, his skills are there and stay there!!

I have no idea how people that switch skills get it done, must take forever to dig just a few maps.

I have never seen a paragon Renegade Changeling..... really?  Would that even be possible to kill?

They can get extremely nasty if you happen to get two or three together. More so if one or more spawn paragon.

Last time I tried to solo a level 7 Ilsh map, I had to give up and bail, because my greater dragon could barely scratch it before dying.

Did one with a guildmate once... entire contents of the chest decayed in the time it took us to kill one.

With a larger group and a couple of them spawning initially... lots of death.

Yadd_of_Legends

Parnoc said:

My THunter never touches a soulstone, his skills are there and stay there!!

I have no idea how people that switch skills get it done, must take forever to dig just a few maps.

I have never seen a paragon Renegade Changeling..... really?  Would that even be possible to kill?

My mystic disco Thunter has killed 2-3 of those renegade changelings in a spawn with rising colossus (one at a time) after I discorded and poisoned them to stop them from healing themselves - but more than that, no, they run around too much and you run out of time
As far as switching carto for locks after you decode the maps, that doesn't take any extra time - decode several maps, stone carto, take locks off a stone and take off thunting. Obviously that would change if carto becomes necessary even to dig up the chest. 

Faeryl

I wonder if you could add a sort of container within the chest... with an interactive type puzzle on it.

Maybe give it a time limit like the plague beast lord puzzle, that starts when you open it. And every wrong move cuts down your time. If you run out of time, it explodes, destroying the contents of the container.

Remove trap, while not required to complete the puzzle, might give hints, like lockpicking does for the puzzle boxes.

RT wouldn't be required to try, but having it on you would have the benefit of the hints to completion.

Petra_Fyde

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm almost sure I remember a time when you couldn't find the map to dig it if you didn't have cartography on the character?  It's only over the past few years you've been able to stone it off and still find the location?

Petra_Fyde

Drakelord said:

Swroberts said:

@ kryonix 
If you want to see a great high seas group event stop by this evening at the Catskills New Magencia docks for the weekly Wednesday whitenet Toss, 1930est.. quite a few participants... If in consideration for change, increasing the ancient scroll drop rate or increasing the scalis spawn from 25% would really help support this...

what time is this?

*cough* I bolded it.

Deraj

I'm not 100% caught up on the thread, and all of this is probably pie in the sky ideas, but here it is anyways. My suggestions:

1. Introduce different chest categories (in addition to the standard chests). These different categories would have loot focused on their specific category, and perhaps items that are unique to that category. Some examples of what this could mean:

-an enchanted chest, would have a higher concentration of reagents, scrolls, spellbooks with properties (perhaps similar to the invasion spellbooks), potions, special chest-specific potions, armor/weapons that are oriented towards mage templates, etc.

-a nobleman's chest, would have higher quantities of gold, gems, special gems, jewelry, etc

-a craftsman's chest, the contents would primarily focused on resources, ingots, leather, wood, refinements, etc

-a ratman chest, bit of a wildcard chest - the ratman chest could feature odd items, random decorations that are given random, odd hues. "interesting junk" is how I would characterize it.

-an adventurer's chest, this would be the chest with a higher focus on magic armor / weapons

-a mimic, special breed of subterranean mimic that burrows into buried chests and consumes the contents - this could be something like a boss encounter that drops special loot

2. Introduce different qualities of chests. This concerns the contents mainly. I imagine there could be something like 3-5 different qualities, ranging from, for example, "rotten", "shabby", "unremarkable", "superior", "fabled". The appearance of the chest would vary depending on quality, from a crummy, broken down wooden chest to some kind of special-hued metal chest. The quality of the chest would be somewhat random - the level of the treasure map determines what sub-range you have a chance to dig up and the strength of the guardians. The quality of the magic gear would be more or less guaranteed by the quality of the chest, and the quality of the chest could also determine the quantities of stackables contained within it. If you combine this with the previous suggestion then there would be a larger variety of chests ("a superior nobleman's chest", "a shabby enchanted chest", etc). The quality of the chest would be based upon the map level and influenced by luck (RNG + luck). So if you were digging up a level 3 map for example, that might guarantee a quality of between 2-4, but the final quality is somewhat random, if that makes sense. All of this I feel would add some variety to treasure hunting.

3. This point was originally about traps and remove trap before I read the thread. Instead I'd like to offer an alternative approach to the whole skill situation. We know a chest must be found (cartography), it must be unlocked (lockpicking) and it is trapped (telekinesis, possibly remove trap). My approach to skills in this area is to give all skill levels more leeway to act, while making the high skill levels the most efficient at the task.

-Cartography: When a cartographer decodes a map, the map will show the main area where the treasure is located as it currently does, but instead of a pin, it shows a circle within which the treasure is located. The size of the circle depends on skill; the higher the skill, the smaller the area where the treasure can be found. Mining would also be rolled into cartography as has been discussed. What this means is that a lesser skilled cartographer could in theory go searching for higher level maps to some extent, but they would have to spend more time searching for it, while a skilled cartographer would be able to find it as fast as they normally would now.

-Lockpicking: Instead of the current method of lockpicking, which involves using a pick on a container and it either succeeding or failing, employ a time-based approach. A lockpicker initiates lockpicking by using the skill and targeting a container. The lockpicker then begins to work the lock - as this happens, the lockpicker uses and breaks picks, and the chance for success gradually rises the more he works the lock. Guardians will spawn throughout this process. Moving interrupts the work and getting hit has a chance of interrupting the work. If interrupted the lockpicker will be set back a bit in his work and have to use the skill on the container again but won't have to start all the way over. With this in mind, lockpickers of lower skill would be able to pick difficult locks especially if they had a group keeping guardians off of them. For a lockpicker of sufficient skill, it would only take a few seconds. For a lockpicker attempting a lock way above his skill level, maybe a few minutes and a lot of lockpicks. Kyronix, you stated earlier you've played many games with many lockpick mini-games; I'm sure among them you recall Skyrim's lockpicking game, and you might recall that any skill level can take on any lock - it's just a matter of how many lockpicks are you willing to burn through. A similar principle could apply here.

-Remove Trap: This skill should unquestionably be a part of the treasure hunting experience, but not required. It should be possible to trip the trap to access the chest's regular loot, and disarming the trap should yield a bonus to the loot. On that note, I think some chests should not have traps. Whether a chest is locked/unlocked, or has a set trap could be properties of the chest that anyone could see. As for how remove trap could possibly work, I don't really have a particularly grand idea in mind, but I think at a minimum using the skill on a trapped container should initiate a gump that shows the player the chance of success, the kind of trap it is, and a button for executing a trap removal. That way, a player would have a good idea of the risk they are about to undertake before rolling the dice with one click.

An alternative to that could be some kind of mini-game sort of like the plague beast lord surgery. I don't have a very specific way it could work in mind, but it would be timed, would require a few different tools for different parts of the mechanism, and every action taken would disturb the trap a little bit more increasing chance of failure, relative to skill level and trap difficulty. Ideally a person of the appropriate skill level should be able to remove a trap in ~10 seconds with minimal risk, while for someone of insufficient skill it would take longer and have more risk, but they could still have a chance if they understand how to navigate the puzzles. By making it a puzzle we reduce the role of pure chance in the equation but still have trap difficulty and skill being a factor in how much of a handicap the player has when navigating the trap.

4. Taking the chest with you. I think it should be possible to take a buried chest with you if you've killed all of the guardians that spawn at the beginning and the guardians that spawn during looting. Alternatively, it could also be possible to take the chest without unlocking it, however at that point it would behave much the same way as a trade quest container, where the guardian will continue to spawn at regular intervals wherever you take the chest, it cannot be recalled with, cannot go through gates, can't be put in the bank, can't be set down in a house, etc. The chest could then be unlocked/disarmed elsewhere, or it could be taken to some kind of pirate NPC at Buc's Den that buys locked treasure chests for a hefty price or a chance for a special item. At that point you wouldn't even need lockpicking or remove trap to be able to collect some kind of reward.

popps

Faeryl said:

Parnoc said:

My THunter never touches a soulstone, his skills are there and stay there!!

I have no idea how people that switch skills get it done, must take forever to dig just a few maps.

I have never seen a paragon Renegade Changeling..... really?  Would that even be possible to kill?

They can get extremely nasty if you happen to get two or three together. More so if one or more spawn paragon.

Last time I tried to solo a level 7 Ilsh map, I had to give up and bail, because my greater dragon could barely scratch it before dying.

Did one with a guildmate once... entire contents of the chest decayed in the time it took us to kill one.

With a larger group and a couple of them spawning initially... lots of death.

"Did one with a guildmate once... entire contents of the chest decayed in the time it took us to kill one."

By the way, another thing which should be taken care of is also increasing the time before a Chest decays so as to give "more time" to Treasure Hunters to deal with the MOBs spawning before losing the entire thing....

There is nothing that upsets as much as spending time and effort in dealing with the spawn only to then see the Treasure Chest vanish all of a sudden before one has been able to loot it....

popps

By reading many Treasure Hunters' posts, I gather the impression that many Treasure Hunting Templates are pretty "squeezed" with skills already and that many Treasure Hunters fear much that the addition of Remove Trap, even by swapping the Mining search bonus into Cartography, might still create trouble to many Treasure Hunters.

This, because many Treasure Hunters simply do not use Mining AT ALL, perhaps because they use the Enhanced Client, perhaps because they go with the Davies' Lockers coordinates, perhaps because they are just good at overlapping the Decoded Map with the area....

Whatever....

Point is, that for most Treasure Hunters, I understand, Mining is ALREADY not in their Template.

Therefore, having to pick up remove Trap would create them much trouble.

Could a solution then be if the Developers where to add "items" with+skills for Cartography, Lockpicking and Remove Trap skills which players could then use in place of having to give up other much needed (combat) skills in order to accomodate Cartography, Lockpicking and Remove Trap in their Template ?

They could go in shoes, hats, Cloaks, Aprons, Talismans with +30 or even more skill in Cartography, Lockpicking or Remove Trap and perhaps even combos of Skills like a Talisman with +30 Remove Trap AND + 30 Lockpicking or Cartography etc. etc.

This way, through wearable items adding +skill points in these skills players could STILL maintain their much needed combat skills but, at the same time, be able to have Cartography, Lockpicking and Remove Trap without messing up too much their Templates....

Bilbo

Nobody is saying you have to run remove trap but if you do not than you take your chance of getting hit with a trap.

Garth_Grey

Personally, I think it's ridiculous that mages can cast a spell to open trapped chests, it's right up there with being able to cast RC and then invis, ohhhh the uproar that would start if we got that little piece of sillyness changed while we're at it !!

CovenantX

You don't even need to use telekinesis to trigger the trap,   the trap cannot kill you if you have 100/100+ HP & 70 physical/fire resistance.    Siege might be an exception to that, (I haven't done a t-map there since wands froze you in-place while using charges), but on production shards, you have a 100% survival rate if you meet those minimum stats, and it's Been this way since AoS.

ZekeTerra

And Magic unlock doesn't work on the higher level maps.

Yadd_of_Legends

Garth_Grey said:

Personally, I think it's ridiculous that mages can cast a spell to open trapped chests, it's right up there with being able to cast RC and then invis, ohhhh the uproar that would start if we got that little piece of sillyness changed while we're at it !!

Maybe off topic, but got to ask, why is casting RC and then invisibility silly? Seems natural to me. I can go invisible to break aggro with any other spell, or as a tamer while a pet fights. What are you suggesting instead?