T-map loot terrible?

jaytin

All I remember is being hit with 'nothing is set in stone yet' every time we complained. I stopped playing before it even went live and I only have a few days left on my sub, it's unlikely I'll be back this time as t-hunting was the only thing I really enjoyed. I gave up posting about it as it was a waste of time, it was obvious only one group was getting heard and it wasn't us. 

Petra_Fyde

Maybe I don't set the bar so high. These are the legs I added to my archer's suit.

Rorschach

JollyJade said:

But when you tried to tell the Devs while it still was on TC the moderators made sure the feedback gets removed before a Dev reads it. Only the ponm-pom wavers were allowed to report their "everything looks awesome" feedback. I've stopped doing maps completely, as after the nerf its a collosal waste of time. Literally a whole endgame activity killed. IMO @ Kyronix should revert the whole thing. But then they couldn't care less once they move to the next thing to ruin.

This statement is not accurate. While unacceptable, rude and outrageous comments and posts are removed, they are not deleted and may or may not be read by any member of the UO forum admin team. 

Cetric

Petra_Fyde said:

Maybe I don't set the bar so high. These are the legs I added to my archer's suit.

Ya... These are just ever so lightly better than a craftable item

So much for legendary

Petra_Fyde

If 6 useable mods plus overcap on every resist is classed by you as 'ever so lightly better than craftable' maybe it's your expectations that are overly high.
In real terms, this is a 12 mod piece, that's according to the game mechanics, not according to players who choose to discount high resists as a mod. - At that they have one less mod than they started with, I paid the NPC to remove mage armor

KHAN

Petra_Fyde said:

If 6 useable mods plus overcap on every resist is classed by you as 'ever so lightly better than craftable' maybe it's your expectations that are overly high.
In real terms, this is a 12 mod piece, that's according to the game mechanics, not according to players who choose to discount high resists as a mod. - At that they have one less mod than they started with, I paid the NPC to remove mage armor

MOST players DON'T count resists as mods. And no, that piece isn't even CLOSE in quality, to the kind of items that used to drop. 

Ezekiel_Zane

KHAN said:

Petra_Fyde said:

If 6 useable mods plus overcap on every resist is classed by you as 'ever so lightly better than craftable' maybe it's your expectations that are overly high.
In real terms, this is a 12 mod piece, that's according to the game mechanics, not according to players who choose to discount high resists as a mod. - At that they have one less mod than they started with, I paid the NPC to remove mage armor

MOST players DON'T count resists as mods. And no, that piece isn't even CLOSE in quality, to the kind of items that used to drop. 

Then MOST players DON'T know a thing about how mods are rolled.  

Resists absolutely are counted as mods by the system and by the devs.

Arroth_Thaiel

Cetric said:

ya, its an item id pay like 50-200m for depending

Well, that's a gut punch.

I never thought to keep a piece with %15 LRC. 15x6 = 90, so you'd be short 10%. I figured that was instant worthless and have been unraveling without even looking. (Plus, the Studded without Mage Armor....I just...I don't even know what to say. I know nothing about PvP.)

Honestly, I feel pretty uninformed right now.

Ezekiel_Zane

Arroth_Thaiel said:

Cetric said:

ya, its an item id pay like 50-200m for depending

Well, that's a gut punch.

I never thought to keep a piece with %15 LRC. 15x6 = 90, so you'd be short 10%. I figured that was instant worthless and have been unraveling without even looking. (Plus, the Studded without Mage Armor....I just...I don't even know what to say. I know nothing about PvP.)

Honestly, I feel pretty uninformed right now.

Studded w/o mage armor has +3% LMC increase over cap for five pieces that's 55% LMC total.

20X6 = 120, so you don't need 20% LRC on every piece.  Jeez when AoS came out 10-15% LRC pieces sold for millions.  How times have changed.

Arroth_Thaiel

Ezekiel_Zane said:

Studded w/o mage armor has +3% LMC increase over cap for five pieces that's 55% LMC total.

Right, I thought that was fighter focused, didn't realize mages used it in PvP.

Ezekiel_Zane said:

20X6 = 120, so you don't need 20% LRC on every piece.  Jeez when AoS came out 10-15% LRC pieces sold for millions.  How times have changed.

I hear ya on how times have changed. I'm just tossing gear I would have died for a couple of years ago.

I've been concentrating on 20% LRC because it allows me to swap out one piece with something totally different and still keep 100% LRC (20x5 = 100). Wasn't keeping 15% because you have to pick up the 5% somewhere else. Figured that was too specific for individual suits, and no one else would be interested in my "junk" pieces. Ends up that I'm running a whole bunch of suits that are massively over cap on Intel/LRC/LMC. Not the best way to do things. This thread has been really helpful actually.

With it so much easier to find these higher intensities, I think I'm going to go for 4 armor pieces with 25% LRC, 10% LMC, and 0 Intel. Hit those caps in 4 pieces and have 2 full pieces for something else. Since I need FC/FCR on jewels anyway, and those tend to spawn in property groups with Intel, I think I can get 20 Intel from the ring/jewel. That means all 6 pieces of armor would be available for Eater/Str/HPI, whatever. I've found a lot of armor (and unraveled it) with LRC/LMC/MI/MR but no Intel, just didn't realize I should have been looking at that armor until this thread. Doh!

Pawain

Arroth_Thaiel said:

Ezekiel_Zane said:

Studded w/o mage armor has +3% LMC increase over cap for five pieces that's 55% LMC total.

Right, I thought that was fighter focused, didn't realize mages used it in PvP.

Ezekiel_Zane said:

20X6 = 120, so you don't need 20% LRC on every piece.  Jeez when AoS came out 10-15% LRC pieces sold for millions.  How times have changed.

I hear ya on how times have changed. I'm just tossing gear I would have died for a couple of years ago.

I've been concentrating on 20% LRC because it allows me to swap out one piece with something totally different and still keep 100% LRC (20x5 = 100). Wasn't keeping 15% because you have to pick up the 5% somewhere else. Figured that was too specific for individual suits, and no one else would be interested in my "junk" pieces. Ends up that I'm running a whole bunch of suits that are massively over cap on Intel/LRC/LMC. Not the best way to do things. This thread has been really helpful actually.

With it so much easier to find these higher intensities, I think I'm going to go for 4 armor pieces with 25% LRC, 10% LMC, and 0 Intel. Hit those caps in 4 pieces and have 2 full pieces for something else. Since I need FC/FCR on jewels anyway, and those tend to spawn in property groups with Intel, I think I can get 20 Intel from the ring/jewel. That means all 6 pieces of armor would be available for Eater/Str/HPI, whatever. I've found a lot of armor (and unraveled it) with LRC/LMC/MI/MR but no Intel, just didn't realize I should have been looking at that armor until this thread. Doh!

Its the str and HP bonus along with either dex or mage stats.  PvP usually wants all 3 or dex stats plus str stats.  If they are on studded, bone, or hide they are worth even more.

They also like jewelry with DI and SDI  as long as it has EP +25 and other stats.  You can look at the items that sell on the traders forum so you do not trash a > 100M gold item.  But good PvP stuff is very rare so, like me, you prob have not found any. hehe

Arroth_Thaiel

Pawain said:

Its the str and HP bonus along with either dex or mage stats.  PvP usually wants all 3 or dex stats plus str stats.  If they are on studded, bone, or hide they are worth even more.

They also like jewelry with DI and SDI  as long as it has EP +25 and other stats.  You can look at the items that sell on the traders forum so you do not trash a > 100M gold item.  But good PvP stuff is very rare so, like me, you prob have not found any. hehe

I agree that it's doubtful I've found anything for PvP. (Although, DI and SDI? I have burned a lot of those. I know I should look at the trade forums....ugh.)

I'm really just interested in how the gear works for me. This thread has been great for requiring me to rethink what I was looking for. I've honestly been grabbing gear that was all "grouped", either all for mage, or all for fighter. Works ok for my fighters actually, not so much for my mage. Although all of my BoD runners have 150 Intel, 100% LRC, 40% LMC, Mid 20's MR, and full Resists!

Plus, almost all of my suits are now matching equipment. Sharp Dressed Man (or Female/Elf/Gargoyle).

Cetric

Petra_Fyde said:

If 6 useable mods plus overcap on every resist is classed by you as 'ever so lightly better than craftable' maybe it's your expectations that are overly high.
In real terms, this is a 12 mod piece, that's according to the game mechanics, not according to players who choose to discount high resists as a mod. - At that they have one less mod than they started with, I paid the NPC to remove mage armor

Barely have to even look at resists anymore, I almost always accidently have all 70s, or more like 90s.  So yes, 10lmc 3mr and 20 stats on ur archer piece is barely better than a crafted item.

The comments on lrc are weird.  Way more than armor prices have lrc so discounting if below 20lrc is just off.  Talismans, lt sash, minax sandals, hawkwinds robe, both jewel slots.  I'll admit in the PvP department suit building is a skill, but I didn't realize it was so far off

Topic at hand though.  This gear we are talking about isn't even close to the 'normal gear' we are used to.  Forget the crazy 15 mod no-name armor, the basic stuff that used to be totally overlooked isn't even dropping.

Arroth_Thaiel

Cetric said:

The comments on lrc are weird.  Way more than armor prices have lrc so discounting if below 20lrc is just off.  Talismans, lt sash, minax sandals, hawkwinds robe, both jewel slots.  I'll admit in the PvP department suit building is a skill, but I didn't realize it was so far off

That is probably just me and not representative of the community as a whole. I look for high LRC pieces so I can keep LRC off my ring/bracelet and have options in swapping out other pieces for SDI gear. The less LRC on the armor, the more I have to push onto the extra pieces you mention, which are harder for me to acquire. Again, this is probably just me.

Cetric said:

Topic at hand though.  This gear we are talking about isn't even close to the 'normal gear' we are used to.  Forget the crazy 15 mod no-name armor, the basic stuff that used to be totally overlooked isn't even dropping.

I'm not sure what to say. This thread has caused me to examine the way I was thinking about the gear. I think there is something else, yet another less obvious aspect of Pub 105 going on with the loot, but I don't know how to put it into words. I'll have to think about it and go through the stuff I've kept so far.

Anyway, I've enjoyed the conversation so far. Seeing how others are looking at gear and what to keep has been enlightening.

CovenantX

Petra_Fyde said:

Maybe I don't set the bar so high. These are the legs I added to my archer's suit.

   The bar has been set by the quality of loot that has previously flooded the market.  thanks to all the unpunished script-farmers.   - now they have loads upon loads of high-end loot to sell that is no longer possible to acquire elsewhere.

  T-map loot is better than it was (with the small exception of 9+ property items) as far as item quality, but Fortified/Of Defense spawns far more often and those items can't really be good because 50% of the properties are wasted on Resistance increases, instead of something far more valuable.   the best thing you can hope for if 'Fortified/ Of defense' is part of it, is a 150 luck piece with 1-3 other additional useful mods & one of them pretty much has to be LMC.

the best pieces I've gotten so far are all "Arcane <item name>" or "<Item name> of Sorcery"

I have a couple studded & hide pieces similar to it (with 4 dci instead of hci) I'm not willing to sell atm.

MissE

Thing is I don't mind the 'new' system, the premise is fine, even the fact that there are rusty, steel and gold chests is good for adding a bit of surprise to digging.  I don't have any issue with  having remove trap on them, nor that on the lower level maps you don't need lockpick just magic unlock.  I like that there are different types of chest and that alacrity's and sots are specific type for type ie Artisan, Mage, Assassin, Warrior, Ranger.

No issues at all. 

What I have a MAJOR problem with is the the lack of loot.  It is supposed to be a treasure chest.

The higher level the map the more loot it should have and the more 'specials' it should have. Instead, you get more 'specials' out of supply maps which are as boring as batcrap to do. And pretty piddling in quantity, I mean seriously 100 boards? Ok  that is fine for a low level maps stash and supplies for newbie thunters,  but you get absolutely NOTHING in an aritsan chest at trove level?  Why bother having an aritsan chest at trove level if it has no resource loot? The other high level maps, other than the odd chance of 3 new deco items (hourglass/skull tile/ancient weps have NOTHING else in the way of special items.

Yes you get 'more' items in the way of 'armor and weapons' the higher map you do, whether they are any good is totally subjective. So far out of about 200 maps I have kept 10 bits as I said.  So frankly I wouldn't bother with tmaps for that type of loot. Go to shadowguard much better loot. 

However , the MAIN reason I did maps was for the special loot such as orbs and essences.  These don't even spawn in anything over a supply map, and the problem is also that are so few places to get low level tmaps in any number (other than malas maps) that since this thing went live I think I have found ONE flipping supply Ter Mur map.

I REFUSE to resort to farming trash mobs to get the 1% chance of a tmap of that ilk.  Better things to do with my time.

It should of been as such

Stash map = as is

Supply map= as is

Cache map = as they are (ie three (3) bits of paper alacrity, map, sot, power scroll)  but with the chance of anything that spawns in 'supply map' but increased in quantity so 150 boards or 2-3 skel keys, or a mana orb, or more essences or or whatever plus the new deco items.  At least a minimum of 3-5 items that are a 'special' spawn item.

Hoard Map = as they are (ie four (4) bits of paper alacrity, map, sot, power scroll) with the chance of anything in supply/cache maps, so orbs, regs, resources, etc etc in larger quantity, ie 200 boards or 300 ingots etc, the new deco items with a minimum of at least 5-8 'special spawn' items.

Trove = as they are (ie four (5) bits of paper alacrity, map, sot, power scroll) with the chance of anything in supply/cache/hoard maps, so orbs, regs, resources, etc etc in larger quantity, ie 200 boards or 300 ingots etc, the new deco items with a minimum of at least 6-9 'special spawn' items.

By special items I mean

Mana orbs, skel keys, resources, essences, peerless regs, tmaps, tasty treats, surge shields, creeping vines, mini artis, deco items, map glasses, octopus necklaces, recipes.

There needs to be a much better supply of the lower level maps for facets other than malas. 

But anyways I am over the whole thunting thing now.  Don't bother doing it any more as something I used to do a lot of has now become boring and the two main reasons i did them mana orbs and essences are now virtually unobtainable due to lack of supply maps for ter mur and in the 100 or so supply maps I have done since it went live I have had 2 mana orbs.

Hopeless.

Violet

MissE said:

Cache map = as they are (ie three (3) bits of paper alacrity, map, sot, power scroll) 

Kind of wonder how many maps you have done in the current system.....

MissE said:

Hoard Map = as they are (ie four (4) bits of paper alacrity, map, sot, power scroll) with the chance of anything in supply/cache maps, so orbs, regs, resources, etc etc in larger quantity, ie 200 boards or 300 ingots etc, the new deco items with a minimum of at least 5-8 'special spawn' items.

Trove = as they are (ie four (5) bits of paper alacrity, map, sot, power scroll) with the chance of anything in supply/cache/hoard maps, so orbs, regs, resources, etc etc in larger quantity, ie 200 boards or 300 ingots etc, the new deco items with a minimum of at least 6-9 'special spawn' items.

By special items I mean

Mana orbs, skel keys, resources, essences, peerless regs, tmaps, tasty treats, surge shields, creeping vines, mini artis, deco items, map glasses, octopus necklaces, recipes.

You complained about alacrity and sot flooding the market... but then want MINIMUM 5-8/6-9 "special" items per high level chest?  Would they even be special anymore at that rate?  

MissE said:

There needs to be a much better supply of the lower level maps for facets other than malas. 

Skull rugs, dark wisps and other players if farming lower mobs for paragon chests is beneath you.  

I will agree that there probably could be an easier source for supply Ter Mur maps, but I still have a pretty good stockpile to go through.

MissE said:

Hopeless.

You really are a glass is bone dry kind of woman, aren't you?

Petra_Fyde

I got my last 2 ter mur supply maps while farming raptor teeth for imbuing
I get a regular supply of fel or tram maps from Hag's quest. 
Sometimes I get fel supply maps if I decide to kill lich in Blackthorns.  

I do stuff for all kinds of reasons all over the place, maps are a bonus I get along the way.
Today I've been fishing for mibs ready for the next publish - that got me stash and supply maps for Fel.

Smoot

I think the problem is more that loot progression in UO ever since the new loot system was introduced 7 years ago has been inconsistant, and plagued with issues.

main issue was the 2 years of bot farming high end legendaries that was allowed to go on.  because of this surge in cheap, high mod loot everyone now is spoiled and expects more (which is natural given the circomstances)

these items we're seeing from maps are on par with what "legendaries" should be in power and frequency. IF we didnt see the grossly inflated stats and frequency from all the years a few players were pumping out 14 mod plus items it very high rates.

(its an item of "legend", shouldnt be seen everyday) 

when despise was first revamped, it took me about 2 months to get my first worthwhile legendary (it might even have just been a major artifact, dont remember)

i sold that item for 450m, about 900m in todays gold considering inflation.  it had about 5 mods plus all high resists.  would be worth 0 to maybe 500k by todays standards.  So by those standards, i think its fine to do months of T-maps, 1,000s of maps before you get something that really stand out.  Theres lots of useable stuff just to gear a basic character.

So yes, the devs really screwed up.  they spoiled everyone with loot for years, then nerfed it back to what it should have been in both power and drop rate.  but the nerf was years too late.

In short, i think the loot is very good, and probably where it should be at when you look at gear progression as a whole, but not when people have become accustomed to the loot we've had since Global loot went live in pub 86, 3 years ago, and definitely not considering the exploiting of 2 of those 3 years inflated expectations even more. 

Thats the problem.  the best loot in the game will never be gotten again, anywhere, and most people already have better than whats currently spawning unless they are new, or have just returned after three years.

Violet

Petra_Fyde said:  

I do stuff for all kinds of reasons all over the place, maps are a bonus I get along the way.
Today I've been fishing for mibs ready for the next publish - that got me stash and supply maps for Fel.

.Thanks Petra, I knew I was forgetting a major source of low maps, was way too early for me to think.  I've been getting so many going through my sos.  

Arroth_Thaiel

MissE said:

There needs to be a much better supply of the lower level maps for facets other than malas. 

Petra_Fyde said:

Today I've been fishing for mibs ready for the next publish - that got me stash and supply maps for Fel.

I was going to say something about fishing, but Petra beat me to it. (And then Violet posted while I was writing.) I haven't done any fishing in a while, but fishing seems to be an excellent source of Stash/Supply for Fel/Tram/Tok. Alydar on Pac is in GC a lot asking people to buy 60 Fel Stash at a time. Said he got them from fishing.

So, that should be 4/7 facets with accessible Stash/Supply maps.

Petra_Fyde

Arroth_Thaiel said:

MissE said:

There needs to be a much better supply of the lower level maps for facets other than malas. 

Petra_Fyde said:

Today I've been fishing for mibs ready for the next publish - that got me stash and supply maps for Fel.

I was going to say something about fishing, but Petra beat me to it. (And then Violet posted while I was writing.) I haven't done any fishing in a while, but fishing seems to be an excellent source of Stash/Supply for Fel/Tram/Tok. Alydar on Pac is in GC a lot asking people to buy 60 Fel Stash at a time. Said he got them from fishing.

So, that should be 4/7 facets with accessible Stash/Supply maps.

5/7, you can fish for them in Ter Mur too. Here's how.

Fish, throw a net or throw a salvage hook from here:


then run to here to fight them so that you can reach to loot:



I just threw some salvage hooks and got 2 stash, 1 supply and a mib.  though 2 hooks sank with no spawn   I think I threw 8.