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Slayer spellbooks only affecting direct spells, not Area spells.... this makes no sense to me...

poppspopps Posts: 4,039
edited May 2022 in General Discussions
As we know from https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/items/slayer-property-items/ ;

Slayer Spellbooks, when equipped, will cause targeted spells to do increased damage to the monsters they are meant for in the same ratio as slayer weapons.

Personally, this makes no sense to me and, worse, looks unfair and unjust to spellcasters.

If an equipped Spellbook has a Slayer Property, the additional damage should count also for AoE spells, not only for direct spells.

I mean, the Spell Damage Increase does also work for AoE spells as it does for direct spells.... I do not see why, the Slayer property for equipped spellbooks, should not likewise work, for AoE spells as it does for direct spells.

Not to mention that, even worse, as I read from https://www.uoguide.com/Slayer

You must have the spellbook equipped to receive the double damage bonus from most direct damage spells, and slayers granted by spellbooks only effect spells that make use of Evaluating Intelligence in their damage formulas (notable exceptions are Mind Blast and Harm). Note that Necromancy and Spellweaving spells are also not included. 

Excuse me ?

Only Magery "direct" spells, pretty much, receive a benefit from equipping a Slayer spellbook ?

@Kyronix , perhaps it might be time to make equipped Slayer spellbooks be more beneficial to spellcasters equipping them, also considering that Warriors can triple their damage using Slayers ?
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Comments

  • MariahMariah Posts: 3,302Moderator
    I'm sure there's a reason for only direct damage spells to be included, but your final point is invalid, by reason of your own quote at the beginning of your post which clearly says:

    Slayer Spellbooks, when equipped, will cause targeted spells to do increased damage to the monsters they are meant for in the same ratio as slayer weapons.

    So mages can do triple damage too.

  • GwenGwen Posts: 210
    Use weapon with Mage Weapon property and slayer and do triple damage. Problem solved
  • vortexvortex Posts: 220
    Every day something new....I do find it amusing though...
  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 2,317
    vortex said:
    Every day something new....I do find it amusing though...
    Something new about something old  B)
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    Current mages max sdi is 223% in reaper form and arcane empowerment.
    For items alone, max SDI is 185. 
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • ArchangelArchangel Posts: 461
    Seth said:
    Current mages max sdi is 223% in reaper form and arcane empowerment.
    For items alone, max SDI is 185. 
    lets not forget the town buff +5
  • YoshiYoshi Posts: 3,322
    edited May 2022
    " @popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Posts on this account have been pre filtered from personal comment or opinion in an effort to suppress conservative views in order to protect the reader.
  • poppspopps Posts: 4,039
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Even Earthquake, which relies on Evaluate Intelligence for the damage done, I understand gets no damage bonus from an equipped Slayer spellbook regardless that the UO Wiki says that spells using Evaluate Intelligence to determine the damage done would benefit from an equipped Slayer spellbook....
  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 2,317
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Spellweaving isn't magery - I believe you need to equip the slayer book of the magic you are using for the slayer to work?
  • KHANKHAN Posts: 510
    edited May 2022
    keven2002 said:
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Spellweaving isn't magery - I believe you need to equip the slayer book of the magic you are using for the slayer to work?
    I don't believe that is 100% correct.
    If you sell UO items for R.L. $$$, you need to quit playing UO , and get a BETTER R.L. JOB!
  • McDougleMcDougle Posts: 4,082
    edited May 2022
    KHAN said:
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Even Earthquake, which relies on Evaluate Intelligence for the damage done, I understand gets no damage bonus from an equipped Slayer spellbook regardless that the UO Wiki says that spells using Evaluate Intelligence to determine the damage done would benefit from an equipped Slayer spellbook....
    Jesus Christ! Do you even play the F***ING game? STFU with your horses**t nonsense. I get it that you have probably ZERO activities outside of UO, but come on! EVERY F***ING DAY????? Give us a break? You bring up s*** that no one except you seems to care about, and you post it like it is the most earth shattering thing in UO. EVERY.  F***ING.  DAY!!! 

    Give it, and US a rest.




    Try using I statements instead of YOU statements 
    Acknowledgment and accountability go a long way... 
  • MariahMariah Posts: 3,302Moderator
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Even Earthquake, which relies on Evaluate Intelligence for the damage done, I understand gets no damage bonus from an equipped Slayer spellbook regardless that the UO Wiki says that spells using Evaluate Intelligence to determine the damage done would benefit from an equipped Slayer spellbook....

    I beg your pardon, but the wiki page on slayer properties makes no mention of Evaluate Intelligence, also earthquake is not a direct damage spell.
  • drcossackdrcossack Posts: 145
    McDougle said:
    KHAN said:
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Even Earthquake, which relies on Evaluate Intelligence for the damage done, I understand gets no damage bonus from an equipped Slayer spellbook regardless that the UO Wiki says that spells using Evaluate Intelligence to determine the damage done would benefit from an equipped Slayer spellbook....
    Jesus Christ! Do you even play the F***ING game? STFU with your horses**t nonsense. I get it that you have probably ZERO activities outside of UO, but come on! EVERY F***ING DAY????? Give us a break? You bring up s*** that no one except you seems to care about, and you post it like it is the most earth shattering thing in UO. EVERY.  F***ING.  DAY!!! 

    Give it, and US a rest.




    Try using I statements instead of YOU statements 

    His language aside, KHAN is correct.  Just because YOU don't have an issue with popps' nonsense doesn't mean the rest of us feel the same way.
  • poppspopps Posts: 4,039
    keven2002 said:
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Spellweaving isn't magery - I believe you need to equip the slayer book of the magic you are using for the slayer to work?
    I seem to understand, that Slayers on equipped spellbooks work for Mysticism spells.... and that is neither Magery...
  • poppspopps Posts: 4,039
    Mariah said:
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Even Earthquake, which relies on Evaluate Intelligence for the damage done, I understand gets no damage bonus from an equipped Slayer spellbook regardless that the UO Wiki says that spells using Evaluate Intelligence to determine the damage done would benefit from an equipped Slayer spellbook....

    I beg your pardon, but the wiki page on slayer properties makes no mention of Evaluate Intelligence, also earthquake is not a direct damage spell.
    My bad, sorry for the mistake, it is UOGuide which mentions it....

    https://www.uoguide.com/Slayer

    You must have the spellbook equipped to receive the double damage bonus from most direct damage spells, and slayers granted by spellbooks only effect spells that make use of Evaluating Intelligence in their damage formulas (notable exceptions are Mind Blast and Harm). Note that Necromancy and Spellweaving spells are also not included. 


  • McDougleMcDougle Posts: 4,082
    drcossack said:
    McDougle said:
    KHAN said:
    popps said:
    Yoshi said:
    " @ popps it says targeted spells, but actually meteor swarm/chain lightning, hailstorm/nether cyclone still count as targeted spells as they give you a cursor to target, and they hit area"
    Well, thanks for the clarification... nonetheless, also Spellweaving's Wildfire prompts a Target and, yet, a slayer spellbook adds no bonus to this Area spell damage... 

    Even Earthquake, which relies on Evaluate Intelligence for the damage done, I understand gets no damage bonus from an equipped Slayer spellbook regardless that the UO Wiki says that spells using Evaluate Intelligence to determine the damage done would benefit from an equipped Slayer spellbook....
    Jesus Christ! Do you even play the F***ING game? STFU with your horses**t nonsense. I get it that you have probably ZERO activities outside of UO, but come on! EVERY F***ING DAY????? Give us a break? You bring up s*** that no one except you seems to care about, and you post it like it is the most earth shattering thing in UO. EVERY.  F***ING.  DAY!!! 

    Give it, and US a rest.




    Try using I statements instead of YOU statements 

    His language aside, KHAN is correct.  Just because YOU don't have an issue with popps' nonsense doesn't mean the rest of us feel the same way.
    How i feel about popps is irrelevant in this case I'm labeled a troll and troublemaker because I post unpopular and opposing opinions yet so many other people just use insulting comments to bully their opinions I'm trying to be better let's all try
    Acknowledgment and accountability go a long way... 
  • YoshiYoshi Posts: 3,322
    edited May 2022
    "I am pretty sure i have written paragraphs to describe the rules on slayer, i thought for the official wiki too however i can't seem to see it there.
    Slayer Property Items – Ultima Online (uo.com)

    Slayer spellbooks work for magery and mysticism spells only, with the exception of i think earthquake as that deals direct damage, and mindblast, because that spell is just weird. 


    so a necromancer can have a necromancy slayer spellbook, but the slayer will only work for mysticism and magery spells.

    Please be careful with wording, direct damage is a type of damage that is seperate from physical/fire/cold/poison/energy (is not affected by those resists) and is not to be confused with the term 'targeted spells'"
    Posts on this account have been pre filtered from personal comment or opinion in an effort to suppress conservative views in order to protect the reader.
  • MerlinMerlin Posts: 235
    Seth said:
    Current mages max sdi is 223% in reaper form and arcane empowerment.
    For items alone, max SDI is 185. 

    I am able to get well over 250+ Spell Damage Increase with armor/jewels, reaper form, arcane empowerment, level 6 focus, grapes, pies, town buff, bard buff... 

  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    Merlin said:
    Seth said:
    Current mages max sdi is 223% in reaper form and arcane empowerment.
    For items alone, max SDI is 185. 

    I am able to get well over 250+ Spell Damage Increase with armor/jewels, reaper form, arcane empowerment, level 6 focus, grapes, pies, town buff, bard buff... 

    Noted.

    @Mariah
    So, warriors’ max is 100% damage increase (items) and 200% damage modifier (Slayer, etc)

    i was reading the guide about 300% cap at the slayer page and wonder if mages should be 300% max sdi? So 100% SDI + Lesser slayer 200% is max 300%? How does slayer stack with the normal sdi %?
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • RinerRiner Posts: 379
    popps said:
    My bad, sorry for the mistake, it is UOGuide which mentions it....

    https://www.uoguide.com/Slayer

    You must have the spellbook equipped to receive the double damage bonus from most direct damage spells, and slayers granted by spellbooks only effect spells that make use of Evaluating Intelligence in their damage formulas (notable exceptions are Mind Blast and Harm). Note that Necromancy and Spellweaving spells are also not included. 


    I'm sure you know this but since you bothered to quote it, uoguide is a fan page which makes guesses at how things work. It is also far out of date. The fact UO guide lists something doesn't make it factual or accurate. As for how this spell trait works again you have discovered a something which has been in the game for years, congrats! And have decided that you think it is an unfair way of dealing with something. Please try to resist posting nonsense it would really help! 
  • YoshiYoshi Posts: 3,322
    "yes uoguide is also broken, can no longer log in to correct the mistakes"
    Posts on this account have been pre filtered from personal comment or opinion in an effort to suppress conservative views in order to protect the reader.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,266
    Yoshi said:
    "yes uoguide is also broken, can no longer log in to correct the mistakes"
    So slayer books do not work with thunderstorm?

    Maybe I just think I'm doing more damage. Because I use it on low hp mobs.
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
  • YoshiYoshi Posts: 3,322
    "no they don't, the spell damage increase that is often present on slayer books will still work though, but you're better off using a 50sdi book"
    Posts on this account have been pre filtered from personal comment or opinion in an effort to suppress conservative views in order to protect the reader.
  • McDougleMcDougle Posts: 4,082
    No matter which book you use it's not going to go back into your strap
    Acknowledgment and accountability go a long way... 
  • YoshiYoshi Posts: 3,322
    "that did make me chuckle actually"
    Posts on this account have been pre filtered from personal comment or opinion in an effort to suppress conservative views in order to protect the reader.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,266
    Thanks @Yoshi I do carry those and they don't go into my strap either since I don't have one.
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
  • Arnold7Arnold7 Posts: 1,450
    Note slayer spellbooks work with the mage mastery death ray doing sometimes over 500 points per hit on some targets.  Rules for spellbooks where likely set on day one of UO’s release.  They don’t affect area damage spells, my guess is the software can’t handle that.  They only work with direct damage spells except maybe necro wither.  Can’t remember for sure if the Spellbook made a difference there.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,266
    I can accept them not working on area spells since they do a lot more total damage already.
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
  • McDougleMcDougle Posts: 4,082
    edited May 2022
    Mages need a cold direct damage spell (other than mind blast) 
    Acknowledgment and accountability go a long way... 
  • ForeverFunForeverFun Posts: 920
    edited May 2022
    Chain lightning and meteor swarm indeed work for slayer.
    As it stands now, these 2 spells get watered down, damage wise, when hitting multiple targets. 

    Consider removing the damage penalty for multiple (>2) targets, please.

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