August 2020 Newsletter : "we have some thoughts on the thief profession"....
Considering how some thieves, be it using the burglar's bandana, the shadow dancers leggings, jewelry and what not, run around with only 60ish "real" stealing skills using then another 60 or so stealing points on items to get to 120, I hope that in those "thoughts" which you have on the thief profession, might be some love for those Thieves who actually invest 120 "real" points in stealing....
I am not against skill points on items, just would like to see more Rewards through gameplay for those players who actually do invest real skill points on their template rather then skill points on items....
I am not against skill points on items, just would like to see more Rewards through gameplay for those players who actually do invest real skill points on their template rather then skill points on items....
Comments
https://forum.uo.com/discussion/5069/rogues-skills-why-there-are-no-masteries-for-them
completly wrong.... many skills need real skill for special move or full benifit for mastery use or special move
Cheers MissE
- Stealing
- Snooping
- Hiding
- Ninjitsu
At 120 Stealing, 100 Snooping, 100 Hiding, 120 Ninjitsu ALL real skills (440 total skill points invested in the Rogue Template), the ability to steal while staying hidden from players or NPCs, without getting revealed by the steal, should be 100% guaranteed (it is a MASTERY !!) and the cooldown before it can be reused be a short one.
Lower "real" skill points invested as compared to the max 440 skill points invested in all those 4 Rogue skills, should provide an increasing lower ability to stay hidden throughout the steal with a higher cooldown to reuse the Mastery.
And before anyone says that a thief should always be attackable, 440 points invested in a Rogue make a thief practically a "no-match" to a character all skilled up and geared up to be a fighter.
Not to mention, if the Rogue also runs with 100 Lockpicking, 100 Remove Trap to work on Dungeon Chests which would bring all skill points invested up to 640 skill points.
There is hardly any room there for anything else.... infact, if the Rogue wanted to also run 100 Detect Hidden to reveal (for example hidden chests...), they could not fit that skill the Rogue template in full.... only 80 points could fit.....
As if that was enough, a thief has to have both of the hands free of anything to be able to perform the steal thus further increasing the disadvantage as compared to a Fighting character.
Therefore, a thief so heavily invested into Rogue skills would be an easy prey to any fighting character.
The only real and truly valid defense of a thief, as I see it, is by getting in the shadow and staying there, well hidden....
Furthermore, a Mastery is a Mastery and if it does not permit to a thief to get the job done with swiftness, success and reliability, what Mastery would it ever be ?
Mostly I use her to steal in Exodus or from monsters, sometimes dungeon stealables.
Is she easy prey for fighting characters? Of course she is - but the idea is to not get caught by them! Discretion is the key word for a thief. For her most dangerous pvm steals in Exodus she gets next to her target, mounts her ethy, makes the steal and flees on the ethy.
Pure Rogue. No fighting abilities, not as a choice, but there simply is no room for any if I want to play a full rounded Rogue (who can steal and do Dungeon Chests, including the hidden ones)... too many skills to have to take up.
Cannot even recall unless using recall scrolls....
I did NOT say to punish templates wearing skills on items, I said to PRIZE Templates investing "real" skill points in their Templates which, by the way, is what Masteries are ALL about, to my understanding...
Players who want to use skill points on items can still do it, by all means, ONLY, they would not be able to gather the benefits of using instead REAL skill points.....
It is a different approach which does NOT penalize those who want to use skill items on their template but, in doing so, need to understand that they will NOT be able to exploit the full potential of that given skill.
ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
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Treasure Hunters
You are not clear enough or maybe I'm still half asleep.But isn't your idea the very definition of punishing someone for not having 120 real skill? Not being able to use the skill fully if not 120 is a type of punishment.
It is some "more" given to those who make the choice to loose the advantage of being able to use on their Template multiple skills and thus multiple advantages coming from those skills in exchange for better and more enhanced bonuses but coming from less skills.
It is a choice that any and all players can make.
Want to benefit the fullest from a given skill or skill set (for example for a Rogue) ?
Renounce the appeal of having 8+ skills on a Template, stick with 6 thus renouncing to the advantages that would come from those extra skills one could have from skill items BUT, be able to enjoy the higher benefits that those less skills can provide when trained up to their fullest 120 "real" skill.
And it is funny that you mention the Bardic skills, because, to my understanding, having 120 in multiple Bard skills DOES provide additional bonuses to the Bard for whatever Bard skill they might be using in their Mastery....
Why shouldn't this be then the same for a Rogue using a whole bunch of "real" Rogue skill points on their Template rather then on items ?
Did Skill Masteries kill players using items with skills on ?
Not to my knowledge.
Want to play with some 10 skills and enjoy the multiple "lower" benefits coming from so many skills?
Fine, but then leave to other players who instead want to play with less skills but trained to the fullest 120 "real" points the higher benefits coming from "specializing" in less skills but at a higher real value.
Imo thieves do what they do just fine. Never had one, have many stolen items thanks to players that understand game mechanics. Ok I have skills, just don't like that part of uo.
I am going to completely disagree with the original opening post. Below is my rogue, which is a pure non combat rogue. In order to fit in all of the very cool Rogue skills, I have used +Skill items to the maximum. I also have absolutely zero combat ability.
A Rogue should not be penalised for using +Skill items, in fact, I think you will find no other profession has as many +Skill items, because no other profession needs them. You actually need the items, to pull off a complete Rogue - as seen below. Remember - by putting on all these +Skill Items, I have had to sacrifice other game benefits - such as any Combat ability at all, I cannot fight anything, player, or monster.
You will see below, I only have 30 Stealth skill, yet items take it to 120. I have 60 Stealing skill, yet items take it to 120.
This rogue is so much fun, it is completely non-combat which I think should also count for something, he lives by his wits. I actually think this style of rogue should be given more clever and interesting content, and boosted.
The One weakness of this rogue currently, is he does not have 90 Real Stealing Skill, to join the Thieves guild, in order to steal off Players in Felucca. I am hoping if I stone something off, raise Stealing to 90, join the Thieves guild, then put back stones skill and drop Stealing back to 60, I can get around that.
There is just NOT a match.... infact, lots of players then boost their Templates with skill items so as to be able to take advantage from way more then just a mere 6 skills....
Would they do it unless they did not have a hell of an advantage from being able to use the benefits from so many different skills ?
Nope.
I am sorry, but what needs some SERIOUS love here are the "pure" Templates which only rely on 6 skills but trained to the fullest.
Please, do not come to me trying to convince people about the players being able to use advantages and benefits from some 8, 9 or perhaps even 10 skills as being the underdog in UO because they are NOT.
At least, that is how I see it.
The Rogue Profession in Ultima Online being relegated to mostly only steal some useless deco pixels from some place and, this, assuming that the Rogue is able to beat a scripter logged off there which is basically impossible for a Rogue that did not use scripts (see the House placing after IDOCs drama....) ?
No thanks.
I sure hope that the Developers within their "thoughts on thieves" have MUCH BETTER ideas then that for this Profession in Ultima Online....
And then I am wrong when I am saying that players who, instead, stick with only play 6 skills but all trained REAL skill points should not get some SERIOUS love from the Developers ?
Yeah, right....
As I said, I am NOT against Templates using items with skill points and going well above the 720 CAP, they like it, they go for it.....
I am only saying that players who, instead, want to stick to actually using TRAINED UP skills (skill items have the added benefit that they do NOT require investment into training them, they are a get go thing.... training skills takes time....) to their fullest and stay within the 720 CAP, should not be penalized by this, but be PRIZED.
It is a matter of Balance.
Players using well over 6 skills and hundreds of points well over the 720 skill CAP get the benefit from all of those skills' advantages and pluses, for balance sakes then, players who, instead, STICK with the 6 x 120 Templates but with all skills TRAINED (not easily beefed up by items...) to their fullest should get ADVANTAGES unique to them that can compensate the lack of being able to benefit from using 8 or 9 or perhaps even 10 skillsat once on their Template....
That is at least the way I see it.
Using skill items does not involve needing ANYWAYS 120 Powerscrolls in order to then take advantage of those skill points on items ?
That is news to me....