Rogues Skills, why there are no masteries for them ?

Tyrath

Someone here should read more, play more and speak less.

Urge

Popps, it is very profitable. If you refuse to learn the mechanics and use the full potential that's on you. If i made a samp and refused to do roof should i complain i couldn't get a cameo? Should we complain that begging won't make us millions?

Direct these posts toward something that matters like why crafting isn't half as good as loot. That's something we can all get behind. 

Tyrath

Urge said:

 Should we complain that begging won't make us millions?

   Hey now every year when trick or treating is rolled out and the new stuff available with GM begging the potential to beg your way into millions is there

Urge

Stinky_Pete said:

My point is that making decent gold as a PvM thief is entirely possible. You just don't know how and I would bet that @ Kyronix doesn't either. Maybe PvM stealing does need some changes. I wouldn't know as I am not an expert in such content and it is obvious that you are not either. I suggest that we both stay out of any conversation regarding PvM thief changes with the exception of me saying DO NOT MAKE ANY CHANGES TO WHAT I DO! 

It would be neat to just add in a couple things to play around with. Dungeon chests do need to be updated out of 1997. Town chests need a tweak too. Maybe steal from some NPCs.

But asking for an add usually ends with a complete overhaul that i am against.

Stinky_Pete

Tyrath said:

Someone here should read more, play more and speak less.

+1

Garth_Grey

Thieves shouldn't be able to snoop while hidden, and I'll just leave it at that.

Elvis

Rogue Mastery + 120 stealing = can disable insurance on things so we can steal good loot again.  Victim can make insurance claim to recover some gold

Stinky_Pete

Garth_Grey said:

Thieves shouldn't be able to snoop while hidden, and I'll just leave it at that.

Oh you... I thought we talked about this before. You seemed to understand then.

Petra_Fyde

Urge said:

I was directing the lol at you giving popps hell. Nothing I said was directed toward you at all babe.

Thanks for that, you made my day.  Nothing cheers up an old girl who's the wrong side of 60 more than being called 'babe'.

Pawain

I want my cook to be able to make 100M gold an hour!  This is not fair!

popps

Urge said:

Popps, it is very profitable. If you refuse to learn the mechanics and use the full potential that's on you. If i made a samp and refused to do roof should i complain i couldn't get a cameo? Should we complain that begging won't make us millions?

Direct these posts toward something that matters like why crafting isn't half as good as loot. That's something we can all get behind. 

Direct these posts toward something that matters like why crafting isn't half as good as loot. That's something we can all get behind. 

I mentioned my opinion about crafting being in dire need for help various times... besides, it is before everyone's eyes how items from Loot is way better then whatever can be crafted....

Furthermore, there is something which also should, once and for all, be ended.

The fact that crafting Recipes for the most part, come from fights as Loot.

Why ?

Because Crafters are no fighters.

Therefore, their Recipes should NOT come from fighting which Crafters do not have available.

And when I talk about Crafters, I talk about characters REALLY played as Crafters and NOT mere Mules... that is, Crafters which Fighter characters have and use only as mere support for their Fighting characters to be self-sufficient....

If Crafting is, as it is, a NON-COMBAT profession, well, then, at least to my viewing, the Recipes needed for Crafters should NOT come from Fighting which only help Fighters who have Crafters only as mules, that is, secondary characters in support of their fighting characters.

Which is, why I LOVE Crafting to be complex and complicated as it is in Ultima Online where, in order to be truly a dedicated and "true" Crafter, a player needs to invest TIME in studying how it really works, spend time to train in it not only to learn the skills in the game but also in how to actually really make items and suits that make sense....

I have always hated Crafting characters being used as mules, in support of fighting characters and I would like Ultima Online, sometimes, to give some love, besides Fighing content, also to non-fighting content....

Yet, it looks like most always the best items drop where ? In fights, to "top" attackers and all that....

Well, for a change, it would be nice that also non-fighting effort, time and dedication in the game like a player who really wants to learn Crafting in Ultima Online (at least for good amor crafting) needs to put in, was to be recognized such an exceptional effort put into a NON-COMBAT profession....

Garth_Grey

Ok Popps, the Devs understand, at least on production shards, that players have support characters. That's why things like recipes have always come from fighting and no one really complains about it, well, until now.

Urge

Garth_Grey said:

Ok Popps, the Devs understand, at least on production shards, that players have support characters. That's why things like recipes have always come from fighting and no one really complains about it, well, until now.

We had recipes in heartwood remember? Look how that turned out lol. I'd actually like to see a total tally of the people banned for unattended crafting since it was made.

Garth_Grey

I forgot about those, since well, no one that I've ever known made any of that crap anyway.

Victim_Of_Siege

Garth_Grey said:

I forgot about those, since well, no one that I've ever known made any of that crap anyway.

I made a stone anvil once, once . . .

Tyrath

Victim_Of_Siege said:

Garth_Grey said:

I forgot about those, since well, no one that I've ever known made any of that crap anyway.

I made a stone anvil once, once . . .

   I have the squirrel statues on a lot of houses porches

Kirthag

OH!

I heart my rogue!

She creeps around, snoops in fel, follows players around, gathers information, gathers loots! She is a crafty "intelligence" hoarder, oh the secrets she carries!!!! 

And not just on Pacific. LS and Baja have some real... intrigue.... *giggles*

She stealths around IDOCS (she is my shard jumper) and gets so many loots - unless there is a scripter there who spoils her fun. She will sell off things I don't want on Pacific - regularly bringing over 10mil into my collective coffers on a good IDOC night. She brings home items that should never have left Pacific or Napa. And you know what? People NEVER KNOW SHE'S THERE!


let me rephrase...
Players never know she's there - and if they do, well, they don't bother her. Maybe is because, well, they don't realize she is what - or who - she is.
sneaky rogue she be! One GM poked her once, to make sure she wasn't one of those nefarious people we all want the gods to get rid of. Got into a nice conversation, provided some information, was set on her merry way.

She sneaks into Tram & Fel dungeons alike, stealing items like there's no tomorrow, and then she will sit and watch (fel) people start accusing others of taking their bandies/pots/or cursed stuffs. Oh the LOLs I get sometimes! 

There I nights I have so much fun with her, I don't even bother checking on my vendors.

Why for @popps you say Rogues are having less to do?!?!?!? Do you even HAVE a Rogue character? I know Kyronix has a Rogue toon, but probably doesn't "play" so much from a players' perspective. It is not easy for a coder to get into the end-user's mindset when they know how the entire thing is put together - (I get like that with a certain ecommerce package). Is why my son who works in the film industry cannot go and enjoy a movie anymore.. he knows how the stuff is done - so the "magic" is gone for him.

Rogues are FINE as they are - their skills are for more than a thieving skill set - is used in so many different ways that to throw a mastery at the "core" rogue skills would be overkill. Hard enough I had to fret over my Paladin... do I scroll/skill up swords, or fencing? Do I want to invest in Chiv or some other mastery? Gods, is hard to find mastery books on "small" shards - let me get XXXXXXXX out and see if she cannot steal something from those champ runners.

OH! something shiney!!!!!

Pure Rogues are FINE as they are!!!

LilyGrace

I’m not looking for the rogue’s skill sets, used in various builds, or the training up of those skills, to be changed. I’m looking for additional content where rogue skills can be utilized.

popps

Kirthag said:

Why for @ popps you say Rogues are having less to do?!?!?!? Do you even HAVE a Rogue character? 

it is not just me saying that ......

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/comment/31835/#Comment_31835

Re: Herbs - I'm apprehensive to add these to additional areas of the world.  I understand the concern that the limited spawn of them makes them difficult to acquire, however, I think the dried herbs fall into a unique category.  They've been around for a very, very long time.  They also are only attainable by thieves - a profession that is increasingly finding itself with less and less to do.

Kyronix says ..... "They also are only attainable by thieves - a profession that is increasingly finding itself with less and less to do."

And, as I said, I frankly wholeheartedly and totally agree with him on that.

I am thinking PvM Rogue, you guys are thinking of PvP Rogue.

While PvP Rogue might be fine as it is, at least judging from the Rogues posting in this thread, to my viewing, and apparently also that of at least one Developer, the PvM content and playabillity of a Rogue is NOT.

Stinky_Pete

Everyone knows what you are talking about @popps. You're still wrong. Just admit that you are completely clueless about this subject and that you should have kept your mouth shut from the beginning. Every time you double down you make yourself look even more ignorant. Go play the game instead of running your mouth about content that you obviously don't even do.

Tyrath

 Popps have you ever picked a target on a rogue character and stalked them and then stolen something of very high value from them?  I have not done this in a while but one of my favorite past times uses to be staking out a very wealthy persons public house and waiting.  They eventually come home with a box, bag or chest of goodies to lock down in their house......... Thinking they are all alone in said house.  You shadow them waiting for them to sit the container down, and eventually they doand ZAP BAM you snag it up into yer pack and stealth away.   Then go to Stratics and wait for the screaming about how UO is bugged and their chest full of valuable stuff fell through their house floor and a GM came but could not help them.   Never realizing someone jacked their valuables right out from under their nose. 

 Biggest haul I made doing that was back in 2003ish when I got into a fel guilds house and liberated a chest with 100   Mage, Eval, Resist, Med and parry 120 power scrolls in it.  Some very valuable and hard to obtain scrolls back then   

Next best big haul was about 5-5 years ago when someone donated a chest with 60 raised beds to me .

  Folks really should  make sure no one is lurking in their house before they plop down a container full of valuable things.  Odds are you are alone but someone like Crotch Critter or Stinky Pete just might be lurking there waiting for you to make a donation.

 If you play based on Dev content a rogue would be boring and not have much to do.  Be creative and play a rogue like a rogue and the mindset of if it is theirs, that is only because you have not had the opportunity yet to make it yours.  Get yer rogue guilded and then rob your guild mates blind,  and enjoy watching the forum crying about a bug that was not a bug at all but heist

Stinky_Pete

Yeah, the rogue is all about working around the rules and the devs. To play one successfully involves being creative. You whining about wanting more content just shows that you are too lazy to make your own and goes against everything the rogue is meant to be. Playing a rogue isn't for everyone... Especially @popps.

LilyGrace

These last two posts are BS. You can enjoy playing a rogue without making a lot of other players unhappy. You're not even talking about PvP rogues. You're talking about being a'holes to other players. Even your own guildmembers. Wanting more game content for rogues isn't whining.

Tyrath

No I am talking about playing a rogue, thief, bad guy character.  When you infiltrate a guild with a rogue...... they are not yer guild mates..... they are victims.  The entire purpose of Rogues in game and Real Life is to make other people unhappy by making them experience loss.  Something sorely lacking in UO now days.  LOL there is a reason thieves and rogues are hated by even the most vile PKs   The last two post before yours were actually extremely accurate.  You should run along now and pretend to be a big time rogue and steal some paintings and sword displays from the fan dancers or ooooo a tea pot from the yomatsu LOL.

  BTW given yer response are you the one that had a chest with 60 raised beds fall through yer keep floor back then?  

Tyrath

 If you have stuff get jacked from your house or pack in tram......... it is your fault for being stupid and not taking the simple precautions in your house and not vetting new guild members.  Remember if you have it, someone else wants it and if given they opportunity WILL take it from you....... in game or RL

Mariah

I believe this thread was meant to discuss the rogue skill set as used in pvm. Role playing a rogue is a totally different, and highly confrontational, aspect of the game that is better discussed elsewhere.

LilyGrace

@Tyrath, I had quite a few PKers try to gank me at my front door, wanting to loot my housekey off my body so they could take my house and everything in it. They never got my key. I had plenty of players run into my house and log off so they'd be able to log back in later and steal everything out of the house. No such thing as locking down your stuff then. I was always able to cover the tile they logged off on and block them from logging back inside the house. I've had plenty of really good PvP thieves *yoink* my reags or whatever else they could pull out of my pack. 

But no. I've never had anyone steal items or containers from me since public / private housing and lockdowns came into being. And I've never had a guild member pretend to want to be in a guild with me then steal from me.

I am glad not to know you.

Tyrath

LilyGrace said:

I am glad not to know you.

  Yer loss LOL.  Sorry I actually RP the Character I am on, when I am on a thief or rogue type, I play that toon as deviously as possible.

  When I am one of the many Tyraths I am one of the most honorable and trust worthy people in game. 

  LOL I am the guy that will always have your back, won't run away and leave you die, and will pretty much give you anything I have if I believe you really need it.  I have given more stuff away in game over the years than most people in game will ever own.  Heck I even give some high $$$ stuff to people I don't like because they will use it better than I ever would. 

 Guess you are lucky to not have met one of my evil rogue character over the last 22 year then

Pawain

Never gave me a PP Imp....

Tyrath

Pawain said:

Never gave me a PP Imp....

  I never stole anything from you either   Although I did stalk you for a while on LS.    Every notice a guy named Stinky hanging out around you?