New Legacy - Honest Feedback on Gated Tame Books and Songs
I'm a long time fan of Ultima and Ultima Online. I started playing Ultima Online in Dec of '97 as a freshman in college and it has been a game I've returned to more frequently than any other game I've played.
At the announcement of new legacy, I was excited to see UO take a possible turn for the better, and embrace seasons or something similar to Time Locked Progression servers that EQ does. The idea of story driven skill gains peaked my interest, along with different rulesets. I will admit, I regret not trying to be more involved with NL's development prior to launch, but I had hoped that the devs would take a more risk/reward stance on trying new and different approaches to solving age old issues with UO Productions shards.
This is purely my opinion and it WILL be different from the UO veterans who are probably retired and have all the time they need to do anything in UO, at any given moment. I accept that veterans have their opinions, but much of what I have to say will probably grate against the very core of what they "believe" is good for UO, and what I believe is terrible for UO, specifically New Legacy.
So lets discuss the decision to make certain skills require items to be fully utilized - yeah, I'm talking about the taming knowledge books and bard songs. This concept on its own isn't terrible, but the implementation here is the worst possible version. Its also been a hot topic of discussion on Discord, and it seems like the drop rate is somewhere between 0.007% and 1%, with some users reporting they've played 16 hours a day for 6 days hitting every boss, getting loot rights, and not seeing a single book. Others have stated that they've done 350-400 bosses and received two books. I personally have hit ~150ish Crimson, Rikktor, Veylara and Icemancers, getting loot rights and often getting ~500+ gold, reagents and tmaps but have yet to see a taming book or a lure.
For a time limited format, unless what we currently have in NL is all we will ever get, this is an awful approach to something that should be a core part of the skills and obtainable by anyone within a reasonable time frame. If what we have is all we will ever get, then there are much deeper issues here, and this seasonal format isn't going to bring in any new players imo. An average player, playing ~2 hours a night will get to kill one or maybe 2 different bosses in any given evening. If its taking players who play 16+ hours a day 350+ bosses to get one book, this means your average player will get a book 150-200 days into the season.
A compound issue with the gated loot is that boss killing is currently the only end game loop. You finish the narrative or skilling your character, and you then jump from boss to boss, playing whack-a-mole, to possibly be blessed with 8th circle magery scroll, but often times getting loot rights and no drops at all. There are tmaps, but with the current gear, most people can't properly do the higher tiers and they don't reward you with anything you can't already get from the dungeons afaik. More gold, more gear drops your house is probably already filled with.
I've played many TLP/Season content games, and generally the focus is on accelerated progression so that when you drop the seasonal events and content, people have fully built characters and thus can focus on the seasonal content. If seasonal events and content are planned, the current loot system is going to be splitting the player base between the haves and have nots. This is how you lose players, not gain them.
It seems only hardcore UO vets who have nothing but time on their hands will ever feel that beating your head against the same loot walls, over and over and over again is what people want. No one outside of these circles wants that. People who have limited time on their hands don't want it, casual players don't want it. If you want new players to try UO, and enjoy it, I can guarantee they don't want this. Its been said that the beta testers (who were probably all old UO Vets) all wanted the drop rates lowered. Why anyone would listen to these people is beyond me, but here we are.
I'd argue that players outside of these "veterans" want to feel progression and currently the system is not providing anyone with that feeling outside of a select few who somehow have almost every tame book by only playing ~5 hours a day.
Even the reasoning for putting taming behind books and then gating them to atrociously low drop rates is not clearly understood. Through discussions on discord, it seems some vets feel that tamers should be put in their place and made to suffer just like the rest of the paths, and that if tamers had open access to every tame, it would be unbalanced or they would tame the best things and then quit. (they often forget completely about the lures...) These same vets don't complain about how their friends somehow magically have all the books, despite an increasing volume of players hitting 200+ boss kills without a book.
When I ask people who, for some reason support this gating mechanic why they care so much about what other players, that they'll probably rarely interact with, do in the game or how they play affects their game play, they can never give me an answer.
Even if I had all the books, I'd still be voicing my opinion for the people who are stuck behind and endless cycle of miserable RNG. I try to empathize with other's when they have problems/are unhappy in a game. At the moment, there seems to be a significant amount of people unhappy about the gated books.
My suggested solution:
Implement quest lines (multiple quests, can end in the defeat of a named boss) related to the books similar to how tamers unlock drake taming. Allow tamers to select a quest to unlock a type of monster to tame (undead, dragon, nightmare etc) tied to the progression of the Congiarium.
This would allow tamers to feel and experience a natural progression while also giving them the choice of what they'd like to tame next. It would also give variance in how each tamer progresses. Most might select dragons first, but some tamer/warriors might select nightmares. It would put the choice of play style into the players hands.
It would keep the playing field level too, as every tamer would be unlocking tames at the same exact rate.
At the announcement of new legacy, I was excited to see UO take a possible turn for the better, and embrace seasons or something similar to Time Locked Progression servers that EQ does. The idea of story driven skill gains peaked my interest, along with different rulesets. I will admit, I regret not trying to be more involved with NL's development prior to launch, but I had hoped that the devs would take a more risk/reward stance on trying new and different approaches to solving age old issues with UO Productions shards.
This is purely my opinion and it WILL be different from the UO veterans who are probably retired and have all the time they need to do anything in UO, at any given moment. I accept that veterans have their opinions, but much of what I have to say will probably grate against the very core of what they "believe" is good for UO, and what I believe is terrible for UO, specifically New Legacy.
So lets discuss the decision to make certain skills require items to be fully utilized - yeah, I'm talking about the taming knowledge books and bard songs. This concept on its own isn't terrible, but the implementation here is the worst possible version. Its also been a hot topic of discussion on Discord, and it seems like the drop rate is somewhere between 0.007% and 1%, with some users reporting they've played 16 hours a day for 6 days hitting every boss, getting loot rights, and not seeing a single book. Others have stated that they've done 350-400 bosses and received two books. I personally have hit ~150ish Crimson, Rikktor, Veylara and Icemancers, getting loot rights and often getting ~500+ gold, reagents and tmaps but have yet to see a taming book or a lure.
For a time limited format, unless what we currently have in NL is all we will ever get, this is an awful approach to something that should be a core part of the skills and obtainable by anyone within a reasonable time frame. If what we have is all we will ever get, then there are much deeper issues here, and this seasonal format isn't going to bring in any new players imo. An average player, playing ~2 hours a night will get to kill one or maybe 2 different bosses in any given evening. If its taking players who play 16+ hours a day 350+ bosses to get one book, this means your average player will get a book 150-200 days into the season.
A compound issue with the gated loot is that boss killing is currently the only end game loop. You finish the narrative or skilling your character, and you then jump from boss to boss, playing whack-a-mole, to possibly be blessed with 8th circle magery scroll, but often times getting loot rights and no drops at all. There are tmaps, but with the current gear, most people can't properly do the higher tiers and they don't reward you with anything you can't already get from the dungeons afaik. More gold, more gear drops your house is probably already filled with.
I've played many TLP/Season content games, and generally the focus is on accelerated progression so that when you drop the seasonal events and content, people have fully built characters and thus can focus on the seasonal content. If seasonal events and content are planned, the current loot system is going to be splitting the player base between the haves and have nots. This is how you lose players, not gain them.
It seems only hardcore UO vets who have nothing but time on their hands will ever feel that beating your head against the same loot walls, over and over and over again is what people want. No one outside of these circles wants that. People who have limited time on their hands don't want it, casual players don't want it. If you want new players to try UO, and enjoy it, I can guarantee they don't want this. Its been said that the beta testers (who were probably all old UO Vets) all wanted the drop rates lowered. Why anyone would listen to these people is beyond me, but here we are.
I'd argue that players outside of these "veterans" want to feel progression and currently the system is not providing anyone with that feeling outside of a select few who somehow have almost every tame book by only playing ~5 hours a day.
Even the reasoning for putting taming behind books and then gating them to atrociously low drop rates is not clearly understood. Through discussions on discord, it seems some vets feel that tamers should be put in their place and made to suffer just like the rest of the paths, and that if tamers had open access to every tame, it would be unbalanced or they would tame the best things and then quit. (they often forget completely about the lures...) These same vets don't complain about how their friends somehow magically have all the books, despite an increasing volume of players hitting 200+ boss kills without a book.
When I ask people who, for some reason support this gating mechanic why they care so much about what other players, that they'll probably rarely interact with, do in the game or how they play affects their game play, they can never give me an answer.
Even if I had all the books, I'd still be voicing my opinion for the people who are stuck behind and endless cycle of miserable RNG. I try to empathize with other's when they have problems/are unhappy in a game. At the moment, there seems to be a significant amount of people unhappy about the gated books.
My suggested solution:
Implement quest lines (multiple quests, can end in the defeat of a named boss) related to the books similar to how tamers unlock drake taming. Allow tamers to select a quest to unlock a type of monster to tame (undead, dragon, nightmare etc) tied to the progression of the Congiarium.
This would allow tamers to feel and experience a natural progression while also giving them the choice of what they'd like to tame next. It would also give variance in how each tamer progresses. Most might select dragons first, but some tamer/warriors might select nightmares. It would put the choice of play style into the players hands.
It would keep the playing field level too, as every tamer would be unlocking tames at the same exact rate.
Tagged:
Comments
Players who don't need them are getting song books.
Lures, taming books, and song books will be on vendors more at the next equipment upgrade, which is soon. Warriors have crap armor at the moment.
As is, you either get lucky, or you'll spend a year hoping to get a book to be able to tame nightmares/dragons/white wyrms. Having a year means nothing as well, if there are story events planned, because ideally more things will be added that players will want to farm, but most people won't even have their taming knowledge.
Also, I did a champ spawn earlier, placed third on that stupid "ranking" that pops up, got loot rights on the boss and I got nothing. Not even an eighth level scroll or a piece of none magical green gear. The second or first place person also got nothing.
If loot in this game is meant to demotivate us until we just stop playing, its working. The system is bad. It forces FOMO on players who don't have the time to play 24/7 and creates burn out.
Whoever thought this system would be good or enjoyable is pretty out of touch with reality.
Like I said, I used 2 fire drakes during beta. They did just as well as the only really good pet.
If there is only one really good pet then why are they gated? To create irritation and annoy players?
But with the gating, I'll probably never get one.
My Finished Archer did not get loot rights. They moved on to the Queen and she is dead.
Yes, the drop rate and gold amount on Mobs was changed in Beta. Both were lowered.
But when there are only three or four players, you will get more drops. Just not the one u wanted.
So, I dont know how many drops they have each round.
I'm not sure if there should be a lot of guaranteed drops. You can go from boss to boss or champ 10 hours a day. That's a lot of drops.
A lot of people only have ~2-3 hours of game time a night and thats if they're lucky.
Also, just did a crimson with ~7 people, got loot rights, got the trove map, and I was rewarded with a plain old pair of studded pants. Not even guarding, just plain studded pants I could loot off a lizardman.
Whoever designed this loot structure for things like taming books should go work for a mobile company, they'd fit right in with setting mobile game rates AND probably make more money.
I'll restate, I don't mind grinding bosses for gear, and even lures. I need something to chase.
But putting what I can tame behind a senseless and useless grind fest is terrible.
Still waiting for a vet to tell me how people taming what they want to tame has any impact on their game play at all. Lots of vets who support this loot setup can never tell me why they feel tames should be gated outside of "because it makes it haaaard!" No, RNG gating doesn't equate to difficulty. It equates to time sink. Then there are the vets that say "well my warrior can't get good loot yet so why should tamers?!" So when it boils down to it, they don't want tamers to be able to tame dragons, wyrms, and mares because they want them to not have things. Not because it affects their game play at all.
If I could tame what I wanted to, I'd spend hours (and pay for months) to just tame and find the "best" tame I could for each type of tame I wanted.
Also, if they'd just add different hued tames similar to cu's, I bet a lot of tamers would also spend months or the entire season just chasing the hues they wanted.
What this boils down to is the devs are making changes to how a skill set works based on the feedback of people who actually don't like the skillset. So the feedback is generally negative, or negatively impacts the skill and how it works with the facade of "balancing" it with other skills.
If tamers didn't exist, no one would be doing bosses on No Loot shard right now.
A pet whether tamed or a special pet is at its maximum intensity right now. A pet is at end game power. It may be months before warriors have all 70s resist then longer to get Vanquishing weapons.
So if you do want to compare gear to pets, the average player should not have Emberwing sooner than 6 months from now.
The thing is, without tamers right now no one would be doing bosses like we are, and there would be nothing to do at all. So where yeah, tamers right now are overpowered, the game is designed in a way that they have to be because all of the bosses murder players.
Taming is also the only skill with something linked directly to the skill (not a weapon) that is gated behind VvV as far as I know. Which in and of itself is lame.
And a Juvenile Manticore.
Imagine my surprise (/sarcasm) when I saw Dragon knowledge book on VS for 1 million gold. lol
Nothing else even begins to cost close to 1 million gold or even 100k gold, except of course the knowledge books which have an absurd drop rate and a majority of the population want. Someone else mentioned in chat that they saw the WW book being sold for 100 million. 100 million on a shard that's not even 2 weeks old.
At this point, the absurd drop rate is just creating a toxic environment, and separating the community between the people who have them and the people who don't.
How much you want to bet it's GMO with them?
This is the reward for multiboxing for GMO. He's doing it at literally every fight. Double the chances of the rest of us.
If it wasn't for community/socializing, I'd probably have quit NL this week. Looking forward to hanging out more with my guild though and helping them learn UO.
UO is and has always been one of those happy places, but man is NL loot just sucking the fun out of the game. I can go hours farming a colored tame, or even looking for that really good/high intensity tame and at the end of the day if I don't get one its fine, I'm happy because I can do what I want to do and I believe that's the spirit of UO.
But this banging my head against a loot wall, watching as the power divide between players grows larger and larger and how people are trying to squeeze every last penny from the people already suffering, just to get a bestiary for a pet no one ever uses?? Its taking its toll.
I also have seen less and less of the people who now have all the bestiaries and lures online. I feel it'll only be a matter of time before people start asking about new content. Meanwhile, us plebs out here who can't even get a single bestiary are wondering why we're bothering.