Macer Builds?

LilyGrace

I did some poking around in threads for info on how best to build a macer for PvM but what I found wasn't very specific. They seemed to be threads that were more about dex/stam gear from past events that were wished for again, etc.

Can anyone point me to threads more along the lines of how to best build the macer to begin with and how you might best craft your own suit if you don't have event items?

The last macer I had was when weapons of vanquishing were a thing. This is where I'm headed...

I've scrolled everything to 120 because I wasn't really sure which I could effectively go lower on. 

I've maxed my stats.

I used a III mace mastery but I'm not at 90 skill yet. So, I don't even know what that will bring.

Should I use other masteries?

Should I only craft weapons with WW on them? Speaking of which, I'm only a couple days old finding out a staff doesn't offer a WW attack. What weapon would be better than a staff for WW? That seems odd to me.

Do I have to cram as much luck on gear as possible?

Use jewels for +15 on a couple skills and add as much SSI, and Stam and Mana regen to gear as I can?  Is this build headed anywhere other than the wrong direction?

Do I need a better shield than this?...

I'm kiddin

Thanks for any advice offered.

Merlin

I have a Mace and Shield Paladin Warrior which runs the following:  

120 Mace Fighting 

120 Tactics 

100 Parrying 

120 Chivalry 

090 Healing 

090 Anatomy 

080 Resist Spells  

I run with slayer sets of Barbed Whips and Hammer Picks for weapons. Human race. Suit is all plate/ring for stamina protection. 190+ stam, 149 hit points. 15 HPR, 15 MR. I recently revamped this character from Swords and Bone/Stud to Macing with the Plate and I've been enjoying it.  I have a pretty Uber shield to make it work to hit all the mods I am aiming for. That's pretty important for any template with a Shield. You can find a good shield for pretty cheap, but getting a top end shield can be a game changer for a build like this.

LilyGrace

Wow! Thank you for taking the time to share this! I'll keep working at it.

CovenantX

I'd drop focus for resist with LMC & Mana leech on a weapon you won't have mana issues.

and yes to a better shield,  FC 1 SSI 10%  anything else is a bonus.

 I generally use reforged wooden shields with 5 Hci, 25 DI & 10 SSI, then imbue Fc1 & 15 DCI on it, then enhance with bloodwood for hpr2 & 40 luck.

LilyGrace

Nice! Thank you....I was just sort of flying by the seat of my pants, figuring with focus being found under combat and reading that a macer needs stam and mana regen that focus would be useful.

And I guess I was wrongly under the impression that resist was more useful in PvP than in PvM.

Thanks for the help and advice. Much appreciated.

loop

Alternative to the paladin & shield template is just a straight samurai with macing:

Mace 120
Tactics 120
Bushido 120
Resist 120
Heal 100
Anatomy 100
Parry 100

I enjoy this more than Sampire. Black staff or war hammer for whirlwind.

LilyGrace

That looks like it could be fun too...thanks, Loop!

PlayerSkillFTW

My Macer/Paladin on Atlantic has...

120 Macing

120 Chivalry (can actually drop this to 105 and up Resist to 95 if you have Gloves of the Holy Warrior)

GM Tact

GM Anat

GM Healing

GM Parry

80 Resist

I use Barbed Whips for WW, Hammer Picks for AI, and Mauls for DS. I have a really powerful no-name Legendary shield that i use.

The Macer/Paladin excels in 1v1 fights against hard hitting foes. The Stagger ability applies a -60% SSI debuff for 10 secs (which can be refreshed and be active on multiple targets if you're good at swapping target to Stagger), which oftentimes allows you to 4 sec self bandage heal between the enemies' swings, especially when used in combination with a Hit Fatigue weapon. Stagger+Hit Fatigue basically neuters the melee damage output of virtually any foe. The Macer/Paladin can tank Life-Leech immune foes that would send most Sword Sampires running and screaming.

The Macer/Paladin just doesn't perform as well as a Sampire though when fighting swarms of opponents, due to bandy healing not being able to keep up with all the incoming damage and potential interruptions from poison spam.

During the ToT events however, i'll sometimes swap the GM Parry for GM Necro, and go into Vampire Form, and then be able to take on both swarms of enemies, as well as single heavy hitters.

LilyGrace

I found this shield today. I just hit 90 mace and a moment ago took the mastery icons out to see what I could see. I saw Stagger and Toughness. I'm using this sledge atm while training. Haven't had crafter make anything yet.

I have a macro set for nearest hostile target but don't have a macro for toggling to different targets (if there is such a thing). But I could clumsily pull health bars to switch. lol

I'm continuing to let Focus raise, figuring I've come this far I might as well raise it and stone it in case it comes in handy for some other build. Then I'll go work on resist.

Raising Resist, is this primarily to keep curse spells at bay?

Edited to say - I did wonder at a Necro / Macer. In my minds eye tho, I see her as a Paladin. Mayhap she'll fall under a wicked curse someday and become a necromancer.

Thanks, All, for offering information to consider on various builds. It's super helpful for someone whose forte isn't this. But I can decorate the bajeezus out of a keep or 18x18. 

:0)

CovenantX

Resist is mainly to prevent mana drain & mana vamp from taking all your mana, which is the leading cause of death in pvm!  -will prevent you from being paralyzed against most mobs as well.

My sampires are basically the same template as in the OP with Resist instead of Focus & Necromancy instead of Parry.   (I use Cuffs of the Arch-mage for +15 resist, locked real skill at 95 so I'm 110 resist, Both my jewelry are imbued

15 Hci

25 DI

10 SSI

10 Chivalry

1 FC  (if you have enough FC (2 FC should be enough) it won't add swing delay to your attacks when you cast Consecrate Weapon, Divine Fury or Enemy of One)

Macing Mastery

LilyGrace

Awesome stuff!  thanks!

Urge

I have a shield swords guy but i run vamp form and healing. It's pretty tanky.

Radst

I have seen so many discussions on those "dragoon" or macer builds, but haven't seen any real videos to demonstrate its effectiveness as a go-to build. Talk of only templates and gear is just too linear.

So I invite those above to record your solo fights against:

Dragon Turtle spawn

Shimmering Effusion

Putrefier

Paroxysmus

Scalis

You should be able to handle these targets with ease & efficiency. 5 minutes tops, except Scalis.

Lets see some videos.

Grimbeard

Radst said:

I have seen so many discussions on those "dragoon" or macer builds, but haven't seen any real videos to demonstrate its effectiveness as a go-to build. Talk of only templates and gear is just too linear.

So I invite those above to record your solo fights against:

Dragon Turtle spawn

Shimmering Effusion

Putrefier

Paroxysmus

Scalis

You should be able to handle these targets with ease & efficiency. 5 minutes tops, except Scalis.

Lets see some videos.

Killing monsters like guitar playing isn't a race the strength of a macer is stagger and the ability to go toe to toe with everything 

LilyGrace

loop said:

Alternative to the paladin & shield template is just a straight samurai with macing:

Mace 120
Tactics 120
Bushido 120
Resist 120
Heal 100
Anatomy 100
Parry 100

I enjoy this more than Sampire. Black staff or war hammer for whirlwind.

Rereading everything here...lots to digest. Loop, I see where you're saying a Black Staff does offer WW attack. But then I started thinking, wait, if you're using a staff does Parry go out the window?

Does having Parry work in an other way or in combination with any other skill (Bushido?) without having a shield in your hand?

Thanks @Urge , I'll look into the idea of a Samp-y macer too. I may end up having to build two!

Petra_Fyde

Interesting.  I don't have a macer, but I do make low level slayer weapons for newbies and returners. Currently I've been making war axe and black staff for macers. Am I making the wrong items?

keven2002

LilyGrace said:

Does having Parry work in an other way or in combination with any other skill (Bushido?) without having a shield in your hand?

The strength of a Sampire is that Parry + Bushido is stronger with a 2 handed weapon versus using a 1 hander + shield.

I do believe that using a 2 handed weapon without Bushido (but with parry) will still proc the skill but it won't be as effective as a 1 hander + shield.

LilyGrace

Right right...thanks for the refresher on that, Kev

Edited to add: Just used Stagger for the first time. Oof! 

Radst

Everything is really centered around Weapon Special Moves. Why? Because it has been unbalanced since day1.

Swords is the winner here: you need only Bladed Staff (Armor Ignore) & Double Axe (Double Strike & WW)

You cannot do so with other builds. You'll have to carry THREE weapons.

Grimbeard

I run 
120 mace
120 tactics 
120 anatomy 
120 healing 
120 resisting 
120 chivalry 
I use the sweet new mace weapon for general purpose Killing
Then slayer mauls as a pally using Consecrate I don't need 100 elemental weapons 
You can easily go toe to toe vs the toughest paragons..

CovenantX

Petra_Fyde said:

Interesting.  I don't have a macer, but I do make low level slayer weapons for newbies and returners. Currently I've been making war axe and black staff for macers. Am I making the wrong items?

   I'd say they're good for mid-lower end suits, once you get enough stamina & SSI, the war axe would be replaced with a hammer pick (higher base dmg AI weapon), a bit slower though.

  My samp doesn't have parry or bushido, so I opt for a Whip/Hammer Pick/Maul weapons. and use a shield for more mods, I'm 4/0 FC/FCR so I can heal/cure quick with chivalry if need be (normally only in pvp situations) as bandaids & vamp form are plenty for pvm cause you can actually hit mobs.... averaging 3/1 swings per hit to another player -see parry (pvp)

LilyGrace

Grimbeard said:

I run 
120 mace
120 tactics 
120 anatomy 
120 healing 
120 resisting 
120 chivalry 
I use the sweet new mace weapon for general purpose Killing
Then slayer mauls as a pally using Consecrate I don't need 100 elemental weapons 
You can easily go toe to toe vs the toughest paragons..

nice

keven2002

This is a little off topic from macing but is a question about the bashing ability on a pet. Would this be the sort of thing you could put on a vollem (as a Sampire) for the pet to proc stagger? I know some masteries on pets don't have great AI; I was wondering if this would be one of them.

LilyGrace

Well shucks, I was hoping someone was going to have an answer for you, Keven. I was really curious about the vollem. 

CovenantX

Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc

the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

PlayerSkillFTW

Radst said:

I have seen so many discussions on those "dragoon" or macer builds, but haven't seen any real videos to demonstrate its effectiveness as a go-to build. Talk of only templates and gear is just too linear.

So I invite those above to record your solo fights against:

Dragon Turtle spawn

Shimmering Effusion

Putrefier

Paroxysmus

Scalis

You should be able to handle these targets with ease & efficiency. 5 minutes tops, except Scalis.

Lets see some videos.

During the Treasures of Ice Event, my Macer/Paladin was able to take on two Paragon AOLs at the same time (due to me keeping both under Stagger), when even just one Para AOL would send Swords Sampires running. Para WWs as well.

During Treasures of Deceit, i was taking on a Para LL and Para Ossein Ram at the same time (keeping both under Stagger, while focusing DS spam against the LL while keeping Toughness up).

During Treasures of Fire/Hythloth, i could take on a Para Balron or Para Succubus 1v1 and win (some jousting against the Para Balrons until my Hit Fatigue could bring down their Stamina, then they were much easier).

During Treasures of Destard, i could 1v1 the Para Shadow Wyrms, just had to be quick with Remove Curse/Apple when Blood Oathed, and prepare a Close Wounds as soon as i heard the Dragon Breath roar.

During Treasures of Tokuno, could 1v1 the Para Skeletal Dragons, with the same tactics as i used against the Para Shadow Wyrms.

CovenantX said:

Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc

the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.

keven2002

PlayerSkillFTW said:

CovenantX said:

Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc

the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.

@PlayerSkillFTW - Do you find the Disco + AP to be more effective than stagger when using a vollem?

popps

PlayerSkillFTW said:

CovenantX said:

Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc

the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.

How do you keep the Vollem alive, though, without having veterinary ?

I doubt that the Chivalry Close Wounds spell can be of much help... sure, if the Dexer goes first and tanks the MoB, then the Vollem would not take damage but, Monsters retarget so, even if the Dexer goes first to tank the MoB, there is always the chance that the Vollem gets attacked by the MoB and, if it is a tough BOSS, a few hits could be enough to kill the Vollem...

So, may I ask how you manage to keep the Vollem alive ? Thanks.

Whitewolf

popps said:

PlayerSkillFTW said:

CovenantX said:

Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc

the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.

How do you keep the Vollem alive, though, without having veterinary ?

I doubt that the Chivalry Close Wounds spell can be of much help... sure, if the Dexer goes first and tanks the MoB, then the Vollem would not take damage but, Monsters retarget so, even if the Dexer goes first to tank the MoB, there is always the chance that the Vollem gets attacked by the MoB and, if it is a tough BOSS, a few hits could be enough to kill the Vollem...

So, may I ask how you manage to keep the Vollem alive ? Thanks.

well obviously your not goin to use a vollem for everything, i use one on my sampire, but only for certain mobs that i know won't retarget it, like when im farming unbound vortexs for orbs

Whitewolf

i been working on a macer/paladin myself, this post has been very helpful so thank you, i have always prefered dexxers over caster, i have 2 sampires, 1 swords 1 fencing. and then i have a fencer/poisoner and now ill have my macer/paladin. but for the macer what mastery do you guys normal use? 

Grimbeard

Whitewolf said

i been working on a macer/paladin myself, this post has been very helpful so thank you, i have always prefered dexxers over caster, i have 2 sampires, 1 swords 1 fencing. and then i have a fencer/poisoner and now ill have my macer/paladin. but for the macer what mastery do you guys normal use? 

Macing stagger is incredible