Improve Swing Speed Calculation

Mariah · February 19

Several weapon speeds were changed in this publish:

https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/technical/previous-publishes/2013-2/publish-81-16th-april/

When something like that happens multiple pages need to be edited.

KroDuK · February 20

@mariah thx, make sense now.. kinda suck tho.. like UO guide calculator for 150 stam and 60 SS.. composite bow and soul glaive it give us 1.5 while the halberd 1.75

Does UO.com got a up to date SS calculator?
Cuz some of us clearly can't do a basic math formula.

Mariah · February 20

I'm afraid not, I use Knuckleheads.dk for my own needs.

KroDuK · February 20

thx, norton do not like the site for some reason.

5.833 ain't a complex fraction.. it's a plain old decimal

Violet · February 20

username said:
Correct, likely a server fps (tick) rate. Aka this request is impossible without a complete rewrite of server/client code. I suppose the OP wouldn't know that as he doesn't use 1st party clients.

That’s exactly what it is.

A lot of players suggest things that sound easy in their head when in reality it’s either extremely complex or impossible to do. This is one of those things.

KroDuK · February 20

What about not making melee 2 hander as fast as most 1 hander? (better hardcap)

It would make the sampire template more fun to play, instead of being the joke it has become.. give more room for ranged 2 hander to shine and make shine the paladin (mana/shield user) without the need of releasing more heresy BIS theme park itemization for a paladin build..

From what i've seen from Mariah link.. i'm pretty much asking to undo this 2013 change and go in the opposite direction (instead of making some 4.25s melee 2 hander 4s i'd go for 4.5s+) on top of being faster it does more dmg.. it's a master class on how to kill the balance

The only balance I am seeing take the form of a theme park bribe during those main event made for them cheat engine users and bots lovers.

The type of balance (bribe) from wich the designer seems to be literally playing the victim and be like.. well.. we cannot fix all the mistake from the past so let's add more layers while trying to make it more fair for a few specific theme park build...

Grimbeard · February 20

They will do nothing to nerf the sampire despite it being an obviously broken abomination

Skett · February 21

^

KroDuK · February 21

The main idea is not about nerfing the sampies but stream lining this poo poo show starting with the PvP..

PvE wise a shield user.. something like a bandaid paladin (mana user spec) should be AT LEAST as tankie as something doing top melee damage.. (like with cross healing)

Make this 2 handers swing speed nerf only affect the melee weapons.. it's gonna give well deserve room for templates like archer to breath instead of only being good at cheesing.

It makes the sampire MORE FUN to play # not brain dead..

Balancing wise having 2 handers with higher dmg base or even better special moves (like Whirl Wind) than 1 hander; sharing the SAME HARDCAP while being more TANKIER cuz of it, is an heresy.

Talking of Heresy design wise; instead of kicking the shins of the sampies with hidden stats like u cannot leech from those "special heretic event mobs" is soo WEAK, unimaginative, uncreative, lame, (I could keep going for 3 more pages, everyone gets it)

There is nothing wrong to move back a couple step for a few second even if the Nytro of this world is shaming you for it (micro P energy/ compensating for his insecurities and obvious flaws).. this poo poo is fun.. instead of standing not moving like a brainless anchor.. aka playing like a bot.

ex:

y'all just can't see the forest cuz of the sampies tree.. better hard cap the SS on those melee 2 handers is soooo much more than "nerfing" sampies.. imo it just making sampies fun to play on top of benefiting a lot more templates..

If we talking about obvious abomination my first aim would be the tamers.. already with an half train CU Sidh I was losing all interests into playing my tamer.. this poo poo was steam rolling with even less risk.. it just take more time & investment.

Edit: if u wanna "nerf" (better hard cap) leeches on one hander while nerfing SS on two hander.. do it!! the goal is not making the one hander more sustainable than 2 handers.. just AT LEAST as tankier (i'd say MORE tankier but one thing at the time.. knowing with whom were dealing with here)

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

After watching that video again I'm pretty sure there's nothing they can do short of deleting necromancy from the game that would stop every sampire from ruling over you like a god. What kind of trash weapon are you using there? A war fork, with no stamina or mana leech on it? I know disarm isn't doing you any good, but I haven't tried using bleed attack in PVM in at least ten years, does it even work on undead?

Pro tip, get a weapon with specials that do at least something, anything, to the monsters you're fighting. And get mana leech, or some regen, or something. If that fight had gone on another few seconds you'd have had to stand there autoattacking and slapping on bandages like a dexer from 1998. And if you're not going to get any stamina leech, at least cast divine fury once in a while. The -10% DCI is a small price to pay for not having your bandages take twice as long because your stamina bar is mostly empty.

You play UO about as well as you make forum posts. The idea of anyone taking game balance advice from you is comical.

KroDuK · February 21

KroDuK · February 21

Lord_Nythrax said:

After watching that video again I'm pretty sure there's nothing they can do short of deleting necromancy from the game that would stop every sampire from ruling over you like a god.

I did 1 v 4 of your kind.. and I still manage to drop one using CC without UOA.. knowing First Gen is frame skipping all over the place (constellation user) with the PvP protection of 2 more AFK guildies sampies behind him.

PS: First gen the frame skipper 2 days before that try to jump me 1 on 1 but he end up running for his life.. wich explain the newfound PvP train.

Lord_Nythrax said:

What kind of trash weapon are you using there? A war fork, with no stamina or mana leech on it?

Damn it.. how did you know? Is it because i'm not standing still against 3 skelly drake? or the fact, by the end of the engagement I was out of mana cuz I did engage with ~35% mana and was spamming holy light like a scrub?

But yeah. u are correct:

an old weapon; I was slowly working on the imbuer.. it's good practice & keeping you sharp while making the invasion way more fun/immersive.. u need to think before engaging.

Lord_Nythrax said:

A war fork, with no stamina or mana leech on it? I know disarm isn't doing you any good, but I haven't tried using bleed attack in PVM in at least ten years, does it even work on undead?

lol, I was on Felucca and by that point the ennemies would stop bringing their red necro bokuto mages or red dexers or turning grey on their sampies and would only engage me on red ninja archers followed by 1-3 sampies trains.. I had to be ready at all time.
I also had swaps:

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/2x/u7h3av060r2h.png

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/3i/cqp7iko60c03.png

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/t5/orh3cp2cnc9z.png

Or I would have been using one my old PvE weapon combine with the conjurer trinket, like:

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/vx/40gsm6ludy2s.png

Lord_Nythrax said:

Pro tip,

Really appreciate it, but no thx.. I would have been using my samp in the tram tunnels for WAY, WAY more rewards..to me this is a BOO-BOO-RING tip.. it was, by design, already way more risks for way less rewards being me, plus legit on Felucca.

Lord_Nythrax said:

And get mana leech, or some regen, or something.

yoo, let's play a game.. I know you are solid in math.. can u do additions?

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/ub/tm970pdbutj2.png

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/a6/s97c9izj3ip6.png

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/hm/soqqfk9e2k0f.png

Am I good enough on mana regen?
What about LMC?
Any of those gears cuck my med power?

Lord_Nythrax said:

The -10% DCI is a small price to pay for not having your bandages take twice as long because your stamina bar is mostly empty.

The temptation was too great to not build the scene for the finale, i'm a weak man..
Ok i won't be mean.. I'll use a language u can understand:

The crowd was almost done and I was out of mana, by the time I engage the next one my stam is full and mana at least 35-50%

Lord_Nythrax said:

You play UO about as well as you make forum posts. The idea of anyone taking game balance advice from you is comical.

Edit: have some respect.. I was already playing a Sappire, BEFORE SE release, doing solo DF's on LS at night.. I had thieves gooning all over my wraith sappire build in 2002 by 2004-05 It was already a semi joke standing still by the pillar of the second room with samurai skills, instead of hit and running (if u notice the change BS have done in the gauntlet.. pretty much bring back the originelle Sappire mechanic for DF's)

As far as I know.. u should be thanking me for making your Sampire build a thing 20+ yrs ago.

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

Ahahahahaha, this guy went off for like an hour and a half to seethe and take screenshots of everything he owns, LMAOOO. I want the rest of you scrublords to take note, this is the bare minimum I expect from the lot of you. Lord Nythrax is the best and most important person on this forum, and when he calls you out you had better put at least this much effort into justifying yourself.

Unfortunately it didn't work and you still look ridiculous. Like congratulations on your sloppy slapfight with some incompetent PVM multiboxer, but now imagine they picked that fight while you were standing around like a doofus with 40% stamina and 0% mana.

KroDuK said:yoo, let's play a game.. I know you are solid in math.. can u do additions?

As a matter of fact yes, that's how I can see that you're running around 5 points below the DCI cap and like 30 points below the HCI cap. Did you borrow this suit from your sister's PVM mage or something?

KroDuK · February 21

Lord_Nythrax said:

Ahahahahaha, this guy went off for like an hour and a half to seethe and take screenshots of everything he owns, LMAOOO. I want the rest of you scrublords to take note, this is the bare minimum I expect from the lot of you. Lord Nythrax is the best and most important person on this forum, and when he calls you out you had better put at least this much effort into justifying yourself.

god damn the delusion is running wild around here!

Lord_Nythrax said:

Unfortunately it didn't work and you still look ridiculous. Like congratulations on your sloppy slapfight with some incompetent PVM multiboxer, but now imagine they picked that fight while you were standing around like a doofus with 40% stamina and 0% mana.

It keeps your sharp.. u wouldn't understand..

Lord_Nythrax said:

KroDuK said:yoo, let's play a game.. I know you are solid in math.. can u do additions?

As a matter of fact yes, that's how I can see that you're running around 5 points below the DCI cap and like 30 points below the HCI cap. Did you borrow this suit from your sister's PVM mage or something?

I wouldn't have fantasize the bait would have work so well.. I pulled your pants down soo hard.. now u looking elsewhere, since you can't address a single thing.. the thing is: u are looking where I wanted u to.. i'm even MORE disapointed now.. it was the moment to humble yourself:

Go to bed bra.. it's enough for tonight.. at this point.. I feel like a bully defending my balancing points against a sampie tram that don't even know bandaid speed is link to dex.

Edit: I mainly use female cuz of the demon spawn and few other small things I wouldn't care to teach you.. sweet dreams!

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

Whew, at least you're not that incompetent. Next time you present a suit for my inspection, make sure to be that thorough from the start. Seriously though, work a leech weapon into your pile of swaps so nobody steals your lunch money while you're standing around waiting on your mana and stam.

Also, no one knows what a "sappire" is and nobody remembers when you explain it because nobody cares. Inventing your own terminology like anyone is going to give a shit is one of your most cringeworthy habits. Nobody cares about how you killed a dark father twenty years ago either. I kill them two and three at a time and my bars don't move because I'm a sampire with proper gear and not some slob with a mage suit and a war fork, but I'm not going to be telling people about it in the year 2045.

KroDuK · February 21

Lord_Nythrax said:

Whew, at least you're not that incompetent. Next time you present a suit for my inspection, make sure to be that thorough from the start. Seriously though, work a leech weapon into your pile of swaps so nobody steals your lunch money while you're standing around waiting on your mana and stam.

Also, no one knows what a "sappire" is and nobody remembers when you explain it because nobody cares. Inventing your own terminology like anyone is going to give a shit is one of your most cringeworthy habits. Nobody cares about how you killed a dark father twenty years ago either. I kill them two and three at a time and my bars don't move because I'm a sampire with proper gear and not some slob with a mage suit and a war fork, but I'm not going to be telling people about it in the year 2045.

Thanks for the contribution to my cause.. appreciated.. nighty night!

PS: stop licking my arse; engaging with the compliment.. you are turning into Cookie.

Edit: seriously u seems to miss the obvious here.. I still want my sappire build to be able to solo stuff like gauntlet (best sustain in the game) the idea is to make that sustain a tad longer between each hits.. u'd still always be full if u don't stand still AFK style.. u even already have the emergency an mi sah ko and samurai tools, why are u crying?.. while making warrior shield users a tankier option while doing less dmg. (if u use the right tools/player side and does the right changes/dev side)

While making more build viable like archers to out DPS solo PvE target your ass by A LOT.. while making the one hander paladin cross healing a viable option again.. other than when the dev kick your shins like they did on the MoE with such lame move, imo.. just let me deal with it.. deal?

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

Just make sure that every time you post about nerfing things, you include that dopey video of you almost dying with an empty mana bar while slowly poking a skele drake to death. Maybe put the link in your forum signanture so nobody forgets what caliber of player is sharing their opinion.

KroDuK · February 21

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

KroDuK said:Edit: seriously u seems to miss the obvious here.. I still want my sappire build to be able to solo stuff like gauntlet (best sustain in the game)

No one knows what this is. Repeat. No. One. Knows. What. This. Is. No one is giving up any space in their brain to remembering what KroduK's "sappire build" is just so they can understand some dumbass story about how he killed a dark father twenty years ago that he keeps telling like a fat middle-aged guy reliving his high school glory days.

KroDuK said:
u'd still always be full if u don't stand still AFK style.. u even already have the emergency an mi sah ko and samurai tools, why are u crying?

Fighting two or three dark fathers at a time while standing in the open isn't like fighting a skele drake and a couple of mummies. You're perpetually surrounded by a crowd and taking spells from them at all times. You can afford to occasionally miss one or two swings in a row, maybe even three if the horde is at low ebb, but you don't just casually step back a couple of spaces to spirit speak and adjust your kilt. You're surrounded and taking damage from multiple sources on virtually every tick.

KroDuK · February 21

me, pre AoS = pichu
Sappire = pikachu

Sampire = raichu

Lord_Nythrax said:

Fighting two or three dark fathers at a time while standing in the open isn't like fighting a skele drake and a couple of mummies. You're perpetually surrounded by a crowd and taking spells from them at all times. You can afford to occasionally miss one or two swings in a row, maybe even three if the horde is at low ebb, but you don't just casually step back a couple of spaces to spirit speak and adjust your kilt. You're surrounded and taking damage from multiple sources on virtually every tick.

Lord_Nythrax said:

Nobody cares about how you killed a dark father twenty years ago either. I kill them two and three at a time and my bars don't move because I'm a sampire...

PS: before Samurai Empire this is how u'd solo a DF's on a Sappire.. but your bars wouldn't be full at all time while standing still in the open soloing 2-3 of them at a time.

U'd lure one in room #5 hit n run.. u'd try aiming the trash mobs with whirl wind sometimes u'd lost control of the spawn (if u didn't clear the trash mage and lich fast enough) and needed to retreat in room 4 with your DF hitting n running.. with the emergency spirit speak close by.. usually by room 3 i was done.. I could start cleaning the room to do the next DF or room #1

I want to make the sustain a tad longer.. so AT LEAST, u can use your brain and hunt the weakest mobs to WW them after missing a swing (WAY easier to land your hit on them to AoE leech).. cuz if u miss the second.. u won't make it to third one on a 2 hander melee sampie that plays like a bot.. standing still in the open.. vs 2-3 DF's with full bars..

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/g6/q6pksvcvv8mj.png

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

When you're receiving that level of constant damage your life bar is either full or it's empty. You don't watch it tick down to half and then go golly gee whiz maybe I should think about stepping off to spirit speak. Going more than a few seconds without a full heal via whirlwind or armor ignore is death. Mostly you try to aim for rotting corpses with the whirlwinds since they at least stay up for a few swings.

KroDuK · February 21

Lord_Nythrax said:

Going more than a few seconds without a full heal via whirlwind or armor ignore is death.

let's shave ~20-35% of those.. making things more fun for everyone..

You have samurai skill, spirit speak and a couple more options to compensate..

Also, quick reminder:

Lord_Nythrax said:
You can afford to occasionally miss one or two swings in a row, maybe even three if the horde is at low ebb, but you don't just casually step back...

Keep in mind genius.. what u saying (like u had big balls diving in standing still with full bars vs 2-3 df's being able to afford missing 3 swing in a row).. when SE release in 2004 and I could stand still to solo one DF trapping myself using the pillar of room #2.. I had the same feeling as what u talking now (and it already felt like a semi joke to me) the only difference is.. mine were big for real.. we had nothing to cuck blood oath.. even with a remove curse pre-cast, when the DF was doing a dbl BO.. u were dead..

Edit: no wonder why popps can't stop fishing for cheat codes.

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

Listen chuckles, you're clearly unfamiliar with PVM on this level. You will never, ever, ever get a spirit speak off under these circumstances. Ever. Just keeping curse weapon active involves a ton of spamming in order to find a few damage-free ticks for it to cast during. Take your little stories from twenty years ago and go home, you're out of touch.

KroDuK · February 21

Lord_Nythrax said:

Listen chuckles, you're clearly unfamiliar with PVM on this level. You will never, ever, ever get a spirit speak off under these circumstances.

https://www.uoguide.com/Protection

Lord_Nythrax said:

Just keeping curse weapon active involves a ton of spamming in order to..

https://www.uoguide.com/Protection

Lord_Nythrax said:

Take your little stories from twenty years ago and go home, you're out of touch.

I'm done.. I did try to pick you up to my level, I felt bad after humbling you (many times).. but this is insanity.. talking about touch...*waving*

Before I go.. u can activate it with 0 magery.. just carry a cristalline for WHEN u die (u can remove it, it stays active).. soloing 2-3 DF's standing still.. or puts your big boy pants on use protection and solve that 35 skill point problem.. no more fizzies for Nystrax.

Edit: at this point.. give me your password i'ma go park your sampie in middle of those DF's before going AFK.. if I have to do all the job.. i'll do it..

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

KroDuK said:

https://www.uoguide.com/Protection

Doesn't apply to Spirit Speak, which wouldn't heal enough to be useful under these circumstances even if it worked. Running protection would just gimp your resisting spells for a trivial gain in convenience. Stop trying to tell me how to do something you've clearly never done yourself, you've never played at my level and it really shows. You're out of your league.

Lord_Nythrax · February 21

KroDuK said:
Edit: at this point.. give me your password i'ma go park your sampie in middle of those DF's before going AFK.. if I have to do all the job.. i'll do it..

Yeah you can cast protection, gimp your resist, crap your pants at the amount of incoming damage, try to spirit speak, get real confused when it still fizzles, and die instantly. Everything you say tells me you expect some slow dopey fight where you can wander a few steps away to heal and it's just ridiculous what an out of touch perma-newbie you sound like.

Have you even played a necromancer in the last twenty years? Seriously, log in, cast protection, put on a weapon you don't have skill for, aggro a bunch of bears or something so you're taking lots of little hits, then try to spirit speak and tell me what happens.

KroDuK · February 21

Lord_Nythrax said:

Doesn't apply to Spirit Speak,

Make sense, it's a skill not a spell, I was using an mi sah ko as last resort while fleeing before SE was a thing (like I mention).. my bad, it was a long time ago.. the special thing about it was the white corpse when out of mana.

*reading the second post* second celebration jelly, uh?..so soon, on the fact an mi sah ko ain't synergizing with protection? Those W must be lacking.

Lord_Nythrax said:
you've never played at my level and it really shows. You're out of your league.

We can agree on that.. when the solo DF became a semi joke after SE, ambushing ourselves next to the pillar.. only when the DF was out of mana that u could stop squeezing those cheeks; keeping all your buffs activate while trying to have a remove curse precast at all time.. but then it meant almost no mana leech.. lower dps / lower leech.

All it takes to be top tier sampie under BS is the ability to park a couple bots to farm heretic items for you during a main event.. let's not pretend otherwise.

Lord_Nythrax said:
Have you even played a necromancer in the last twenty years?

I did use my sappire the third day of the invasion ~170 artifacts in half the time it would have took me to collect ~100 on my paladin.. using that slow paladin weapon from the event into wraith form under protection.. I had no fun competing with them bots on Trammel.

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/pb/xbrfl36jbrrb.png

Lord_Nythrax said:

Seriously, log in, cast protection, put on a weapon you don't have skill for, aggro a bunch of bears or something so you're taking lots of little hits, then try to spirit speak and tell me what happens.

ok, Nulhax, calm your tits.. you're pushing your luck.. let's not pretend protection was not to cast curse weapon.. cuz a real one couldn't afford to loop curse weapon like a scrub, gambling with his life.

You were the one saying, even someone below 75 IQ could clear all the PvE on UO cuz it's that easy.. nothing compare to the most recent "action game".. it was in answer to Cookie, when he was speaking like you do!

Meanwhile...

That hot bath with:

was fire ^^

Mariah · February 21

It seems this thread has devolved into something that has no relation to swing speed calculation. I think, therefor, it is no longer needed.

Perhaps @KroDuK and @Lord_Nythrax can take their conversation to DM.

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